by DL-Online
Letter: Family, faith are the answers to America’s problems
January 30, 2013 at 6:00 am in DL-Online
These days our country is “up-in-arms” over the shootings that have recently occurred in Connecticut and elsewhere in too many places. Continue Reading
“Only by upholding the family and changing hearts and minds by the Lord Jesus Christ will this problem be addressed.”
In Mark 3:31ff Jesus rejects his own family preferring those who make up his group of followers. Hardly and example of “upholding the family.”
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The lack of a family in the black community is sure a big success story? How about the murderer in Newtown, Ct., where was his father?
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Lack of Faith, religions, ect. Has absolutly nothing to do with violence. Some of the most violent times/wars were/are justified by following what the believers religion told them to do. Suicide bombers are promised a gakle of virgins on the other side. Isreal is a constant war ground. And I am only citing present day conflicts
Hot debate. What do you think?
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for real?
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I owe my life to a woman like Corrine. If I’d have had to depend on an aborter I wouldn’t be here. For that matter no one else commenting here would be here either. Great job Corrine.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Faith and jesus christ our lord were the cause of the crusades! A series of violence and war started by religious leaders.
http://www.middle-ages.org.uk/the-crusades.htm
The fact that religion has caused violence throughout the history of the world only proves that removal adding religion to the schools/younger generation will have no result on ending the recent series of violent attacks.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Religion hasn’t caused violence, the screwballs that think killing in the name of religion is ok have. I’m sure we can find ample examples of the non-religious causing plenty of violence. The contention that religion causes all violence is laughable.
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For millenia the screwballs have spoken in the name of religion and people have blindly followed them. That is the nature of religion: blind faith to whom you perceive to be called by God, whether it be Isaiah, Jesus, Mohammed, Joseph Smith, or David Koresh.
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“Onward christian soldiers
Marching as to war
With the cross of Jesus
Going on before!”
Yeah. No violent connotations there, right?
Some of the most heinous acts of violence have been committed in the name of various gods and messiahs, christianity included and among some of the worst.
It’s like this:
If you don’t know the difference between right and wrong, good and evil, you don’t lack religion. You lack empathy.
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So the same crusaders that went to the Middle East that attacked Jews were nut jobs? Why did these Christians attack Jews? Well because the Jews killed Jesus which was the Christian belief. The freakin Popes started wars for the own benefit.
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So what are you saying? That it’s OK to kill Jews because they killed Jesus? You may not realize how much you have in common with many in the middle east.
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Not at all. Just showing these so-called Christians what they have done throughout history and why they did it.
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We can only surmise then that your claim is that Christians are evil, atheists are good. Hogwash.
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To say that religion/faith will end all of this violence is rediculous. People following there religion are responsible for some of the most horrific acts that have happened on this earth. But we are suppose to forget about the past and focus on the perfect bible. And let’s not forget about the screwballs who started the crusades. Did you forget The crusades were started by the pope and his fellow leaders of the time.
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The crusades were in response to the wars of conversion perpetrated by the Muslims.
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Oh, come on Ron. The crusades. The Crusades? What century do you live in? How about slave trading – do you still see it as a current issue? Do you still fear the Cossacks? Do you hurry past Catholic Churches or just totally avoid them?
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You do know that Putin brought back the Cossacks in 2005?
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Are you just being cute or do you have a point?
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Just stating a fact. You thought you were being smart bringing up the Cossacks without the knowledge that they were part of the Russian Army.
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So Stan, your point is that I thought I was being smart. You don’t know that. Your comment does not change the point of my original comment. You are just being obtuse and are not helpful at all to the discussion.
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Brought them back from what? The dead? Calling some group Cossacks doesn’t make them Cossacks.
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Actually they are the decedants of the original Cossacks.
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Stan – so what. Your spouting of your useless knowledge on this current subject is worthless.
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The hopeless mockery of good Christian people by the atheists here has more to say about the sad state this country is in than anything else.
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True. I would desire it to be otherwise. Yet they spout their hatred with ease and do not see how it contradicts their opinion of Christians.
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Smartimus, I fixed your posts.
“I see nothing in Christianity to be hopeful about or that is of benefit to anyone. It’s just another excuse by Christians to discard their conscience and do what they please.”
“Christians mock good Atheist people and then lie about it claiming they didn’t. Of course there is nothing wrong with that for a Christian.”
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Dude, why are you here?
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Exercising my 1st Amendment right. Or do only rightwing Christians, that are always whining that their 1st Amendment rights are being infringed upon, have that right?
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Dude – you are showing more ignorance. You do not have first amendment rights here. There are rules you must follow.
I asked why you are here because you cannot stay on topic and you are very caustic.
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Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
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No one is “mocking” “good christian people”. We are only bringing those darn facts to the argument. You cannot deny many violent acts have been preformed because of religion
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“You cannot deny many violent acts have been preformed because of religion”
Are you talking about current performance, like in your lifetime, or are you just here to show you were sort of awake in history class? Which faiths, or religions, performed these violent acts that you refer to?
My opinion is that the letter writer has a valid point. Good families and being Christlike would do much to make the world a better place.
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http://www.prochoice.org/about_abortion/violence/history_violence.html Now you will probably say this was to prevent deaths. Killing to justify stopping a legal act is ok with you I guess.
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Please stay on topic Stan. Tell me, which faith, or religion, are they discussing on your link.
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You asked a question and I answered it with fact and still you complain?
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I didn’t ask you a question Stan. You brought up abortion – not on topic dude. Not related to the question I did ask anyway. Where am I complaining?
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Your question asked about violence that was current performed by Christians so I supplied a list.
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Atheists mock good Christian people and then lie about it claiming they didn’t. Of course there is nothing wrong with that for an atheist.
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I see nothing in atheism to be hopeful about or that is of benefit to anyone. It’s just an excuse by atheists to discard their conscience and do what they please.
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Would that be like the good Christian kids that go to school at say Shanley HS, Oak Grove HS, or any other Christian school that are having premarital sex and using contraception? They seem to be doing what feels good.
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Who is claiming that Christians are perfect? Churches are populated with sinners.
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Smartimus, you may not be claiming that Christians are perfect, but you are certainly asserting that non-believers are imperfect. The assertion that being an atheist is just an excuse to “disregard their conscience and do what they please” contains the implicit falsity that only Christians are moral and atheists are lacking moral direction. Non-believers are no more likely to justify their behavior through their lack of belief than Christians are to justify their behavior through their belief; some Christians steal, some don’t – some atheist steal, some don’t. There is a cute little saying that describes this situation very well: Morality is doing what is right regardless of what you are told; religion is doing what you are told regardless of what is right.
Interesting that you would refer to disregarding “their conscience”. That statement implies that everyone, regardless of their belief, is inherently moral. So you must either believe 1) that only Christians have the tools to follow their conscience; or 2) that Christianity isn’t necessary to follow your conscience. Which is it?
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Please delineate the moral precepts that atheists live by?
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Thats actually wonderfully funny “smart”imus. Are you under the impression that there is one notion of atheism? Certainly any morality based on social contract theory, utilitarianism, virtue ethics, Kant’s categorical imperative, etc. works just fine without the notion of God. The use of divine command theory (that God is the source of morality) actually is a bit of a show stopper as that basic assertion eliminates back and forth discussion (much like having, say, a Muslim and Christian gets pointless if they simply cling to the notion my god is right).
And lets face it, there aren’t a lot of atheists. Lots of us Christians though are critical of your modern “good” Christians. Too many of the modern “good, church-going” Christians seem to have not read the Bible and instead simply listen to ministers/priests/etc. who have other agendas (e.g., no abortion but execution is ok, God wants us all to be wealthy, the way to change people’s minds on abortion is not by supporting young mothers who need economic help to have children but instead to simply ban it, withholding information about pedophiles to protect the church’s priests and reputations, etc.).
Having read the Bible I find it astonishing that anyone who claims to be Christian can also be Republican. The Republican party stands opposed to everything Christ talked about as important (hint, that does not include abortion, homosexuality, but does include consideration for the less well off, the poor, etc.). But hey, thats just my opinion.
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RickM, why didn’t you just say ” I don’t know any” ?
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RickM said: “The Republican party stands opposed to everything Christ talked about as important”
I am not a Republican and I think that is one of the most absurd things written here lately. If you actually believe that statement how about some elaboration to support your opinion.
Joe Smith, I prefer doing the right thing when no one is watching.
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Smartimus, to answer your question about what precepts an atheist may follow, I assume it would vary, but you need to read your own posts. This particular thread started with your assertion that atheist used their non-belief to justify ignoring their conscience. Hence, according to your own post, everyone including an atheist has a conscience that directs them toward moral behavior. Interesting that you were unable to answer the simple question that I posted; do you believe 1) that only Christians have the tools to follow their conscience; or 2) that Christianity isn’t necessary to follow your conscience?
RickM, great post until your final paragraph. The suggestion that Republicans stand opposed to everything Christ is attributed to saying is incredible. Simply do a Google search for charitable contributions broken down by political leaning and you’ll discover that Republicans, regardless of their economic circumstance, consistently provide greater charitable contributions than those who identify themselves as Democrats. The opposition isn’t to helping the poor, the opposition is to burdening future generations with debt to satisfy the greed of the current generation, taking from some to redistribute to others and welfare programs that promote dependency rather than self-sufficiency. Using an example from Sunday school, Republicans see the value in teaching someone to fish while Democrats believe that the feeding the poor means taking fish from the fisherman and freely distributing them to others without the need to ever break that cycle – just keeping taking from the fisherman. As I’ve posted several times, the Clinton Administration with the help of a Republican Congress effectively reduced poverty by encouraging people to return to the workforce. Since the 1990s those reforms have dismantled (mostly through executive order) so that now 35% of the population receives means tested benefits and 49% of the population receives transfer benefits.
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“Having read the Bible I find it astonishing that anyone who claims to be Christian can also be Republican.”
That is because you are not reading past the words and seeing the historical context. Judaism begins with a tribal and clan society: One for all and all for one. The New Testmaent reflects that the bulk of Christian converts came from the poor masses. Why do you think Jesus is made to exalt the poor and chastise the rich? It’s a great come-on for proselityzing. That all changed when Christianity became the official religion of the Empire.
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I see no one can come up with a list of values shared by atheists, but of course that is no surprise. By “ignoring their conscience” I mean that atheists aren’t unaware of Christian precepts and choose to reject those they find inconvenient. How can an atheist know right from wrong in any matter unless we define right as what one believes to be so by their own choosing. Right could be anything the individual chooses as there are no limits. Clearly in our own experience in the United States barbaric acts once considered wrong are now percieved as right.
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Gene, if you literally believe that everything Christ said about the poor, the meek, the hungry, etc. is all just a “come-on” for his true message (and so are discarding roughly half or of the new testament including almost all of the parables), then under that assumption I would have to concede that then the Republican party might jibe better with what is left (since basically nothing but the old testament is left — of course, wouldn’t that mean you are closer to being Jewish than Christian??).
Of course, since you would be dropping what most consider to be the central teachings of Christ I can see why it would be hard for you to understand my statement. Let me restate my assertion for your assumptions: “If you are Christian and read the Bible and believe that Christ did actually care about the poor, the meek, the downtrodden and that he wasn’t just trying to draw crowds with those statements, then I cannot imagine how you can also be Republican.”
Whew, and folks sometimes get on me for minimizing some passages of the Bible — at least I only try to apply a historical perspective to the old testament. But hey, I guess they make all kinds of “Christ”ians — even ones who think the New Testament was just advertising.
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@”Smart”imus – as I pointed out, atheists don’t share monolithic core beliefs. Just as Gene demonstrates that not all Christians share core beliefs. Just as not all Christian beliefs have stayed stable (slavery used to be just fine, not so much anymore). Atheists are not a monolithic group.
As to being able to define right from wrong, every one of the ethical theories I mentioned in my previous response gives you a method for determining right from wrong. For example, I am enamored of Kant’s second categorical imperative: “Act in such a way that you treat humanity, whether in your own person or in the person of any other, never merely as a means to an end, but always at the same time as an end.” It is actually quite easy to derive right from wrong in almost any situation from these rules (it helps that lots of people have been asking that central question – how do I know right from wrong and considering such rules). One of the limits of divine command theory is that the laws of God do not always seem to be on point so you end up interpreting. In Judaism you get Talmudic law, which encompasses opinions from thousands of people on different subjects. The Catholic church developed its hierarchy and the writings of some of its great philosophers (e.g., Thomas Aquinas). Then the Protestant tradition involved its own writers who interpreted (e.g., Martin Luther, John Calvin). This was followed by people who created new versions of these interpretations with new writings (Muhammad led to Islam, Joseph Smith and Brigham Young brought us Mormonism, etc.). This is obviously greatly simplified.
So, please stop with asking what the “list of values shared” by atheists are until you can list what those values are for Christians (and get even just the other Christians on here to agree with you).
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@JoeSmith
BTW, the charitable contributions statistic is one of those well known misapplications of statistics. It is true only if you count charitable contributions to the religious organizations people belong to. Factor those out and there is an ever so slight leaning towards liberals in charitable giving.
The rest of your argument sounded like late night Fox stuff, and has been addressed many times before. No, Republicans cutting taxes across the board has not particularly helped the poor. Clinton’s balancing the budget certainly did help the economy which helped the poor, but even under Clinton helping the poor wasn’t a major focus.
P.S. I love the teaching a man to fish stuff. You do realize that a significant part of the money that we do spend on poverty goes towards job training? And that a huge portion of the people who do receive food in the form of programs like food stamps are children (perhaps we should only give kids food if they are willing to drop out of school and start learning a trade)?
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Actually, it’s your blanket statement I find misguided. Would you ever say “I read the Bible and find it quite astonishing that anyone who is Christian would go to a doctor”? Seeing any reference to “medicine” there is laying on of hands and exorcisms. As I said, the Bible is a reflection of the time it was written, which explains its perspective which is no longer accepted on numerous issues: slavery, the inferiority of women, Onanism, and the like.
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Leaving aside the obvious false equivalence in your argument, that doctors by and large do not seem to advocate for particular moral rules, while politicians (at least arguably) do, your argument also fails on its face.
There are plenty of folks who choose not to go to certain types of doctors because of their religious beliefs. People who profess to be Jehovah’s Witnesses do not believe in blood transfusions, so one could argue that being a Jehovah’s Witness is incompatible with being a surgeon or going to a surgeon. Christian Scientists avoid all but the most basic doctoring. Scientologists avoid psychiatrists. So, yes, if Christianity adopted a Jehovah’s witness viewpoint we might see the end of modern surgery.
In my statement, I am simply suggesting that the message of the current incarnation of the Republican party (i.e., little or no government, we all must look out for ourselves, etc.) does not fit with the core ideas of Christianity. The current Republican party seems to be much more in line with Ayn Rand’s Objectivism. Not that this is viewpoint is invalid (though it is best connected with atheism), but it takes some special stretching to call it Christianity (i.e., like claiming that Christ’s concerns for the poor, the downtrodden, etc. were just a “come-on” to get people into the religion).
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My point was simple, if you base your point on the lack praise for Republican ideals in the Bible, there is also lack of praise for doctors. If you follow the Bible, then you must believe in a purely communal society, all is equally divided. Works fine for 13 people, not so well for a country.
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Yes, I do base my point on lack of praise for Republican ideals in the Bible. And no, I do not see the Bible as advocating a “purely communal society, all is equally divided.” But if thats how you see it this gives me further insight into your views of the Bible and Christianity.
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So, when a priest commits a sexual act upon a helpless victim, would this not be considered an act of violence? Is this current enough for you?
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Of course it is an act of violence the same as when an atheist commits the same crime.
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Unlike the priests though who try and use religion to justify their actions. Along with their position in the church to silence the victims. Though the hierarchy of the church knew what they were/are doing and move them to a new parish for fresh victims. All to protect the church. How Christian of them.
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What they did has nothing to do with Christianity but everything to do with evil. Paying lip service to being a Christian doesn’t make them Christians.
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So you are saying the Bishops, Cardinals, et al of the Catholic Church are not Christians? Do you have a white hood? That was one of the main mantras of the KKK. Catholics were evil.
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Stan your nonsense is boundless.
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No it is not. What it is you make comments that are so simple to prove wrong. Then you try and spin away.
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Stan I can accept that your nonsense knows no bounds. Sorry about the incorrect terminology.
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When unable to debate the topic resort to name calling. You must watch a lot of FauxNews, Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh because just like your sources it is so easy to debunk. I sure would like to be there when St. Peter tells you that all the hate you have spewed and carried with you will keep you out of your heaven.
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Hey Stan, maybe this will cheer you up, you old sad sack.
http://www.buzzfeed.com/summeranne/instantly-improve-your-day-with-this-magical-baby
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Sorry smartimus but it is you who is carrying so much hate in your heart for all non-white non-christen people. Same mantra used by the KKK to justify their hatred. And yes they still called themselves Christians also. Somehow killing anyone non-white non-Christians was their calling from god. You poor, angry white man who has no one but himself to blame for his lot in life.
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Stan giglio,” Do you have a white hood?” “same mantra used by the kkk” in reference to smartimus.
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This comment was in reference to stan giglio “When unable to deate the topicresort to name calling”, somehow it ended up down here.
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Do you find using the reply button that difficult?
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Doesn’t the christian faithful preach hate? By hate I mean that a homosexual cannot marry the person they love. They do this because “god says it is wrong”. How is this making the world a better place. All man is created equal unless he is of a different sexual preference? Or of a different color skin? Or of a different belief? And yes religion was used to justify segregation in the south. And religion was used to convert the native americans and destroy their culture and land! But let’s forget about these darn “facts”
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So your contention is that all Christians are racist, bigotted homophobes and you expect to have credibility. Good luck with that.
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Smartimus states “I see nothing in atheism to be hopeful about or that is of benefit to anyone. It’s just an excuse by atheists to discard their conscience and do what they please.” And. “Atheists mock good Christian people and then lie about it claiming they didn’t. Of course there is nothing wrong with that for an atheist.”
I do not classify myself as an atheist smartimus. I understand I fit the defenition because I do not believe in god. In my observations and studies throughout my life I have come to the conclusion that science and history just disproves too many key “facts” of the bible. The world was not created by god, adam and eve were not the first humans god created, and evolution is real.
I have a lot to be hopeful in my life. I have a great family with great morals. I live a productive and happy life. I am in control of my life and not some powerful spiritual being. I do not need to go to church to feel better about myself. Imagine this I have a conscience and the worst crime I have commited is a couple speeding tickets.
I have never stated that a christian is a bad person. I have only stated that religion is not perfect. It is not the answer to our worlds problems. I have only stated the facts about your religionWho is mocking who?
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If you don’t classify yourself as an atheist what are you complaining about? “I have never stated that a Christian is a bad person”, “Doesn’t the Christian faith preach hate?”, “People following their religion are responsible for some of the most horrific acts that have happened on Earth”, ron burgundy made these statements and more, yet denies mocking Christianity.
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“I have only stated that religion is not perfect.”
Who said it was?
“It is not the answer to our worlds problems.”
It sure can’t hurt. Enlighten us – what is the answer.
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Religion normally means the big mainstream religions. But if you look at the definition of religion, it can encompass a whole lot more, stuff that is not normally seen as religion. And using this broader view, religion doesn’t seem so special compared to non-religion.
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Clearly violence is not limited to any particular group of individuals and violence is initiated by people of all beliefs and non-beliefs. What troubles me about this letter is the arrogance based on the unquestioning belief that Christianity is the only path to ending violence, morality and justice. The implicit assertion is that you must be a Christian to be just and moral. While Christianity may be used as a vehicle to proceed down a just and moral path, it is not the exclusive vehicle for reaching that goal nor does Christianity assure that the path being followed will be just and moral. Any individual can lead a just and moral life. While there are certainly many Christians whom I would consider just and moral, Christianity doesn’t have a monopoly or a guarantee on justice or morality.
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“What troubles me about this letter is the arrogance based on the unquestioning belief that Christianity is the only path to ending violence, morality and justice.”
Wow – that’s what troubles you? You must be a very troubled person.
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In other words, anyone can talk the walk but if you can’t walk the walk, then perhaps nothing should be said at all.
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Wtf, are you talking about smartimus? You are trying to classify an entire group of people that have nothing in common. You can live a healthy productive life and not believe in the bible. There is no singular reason on why people do not believe in god. For me I cannot believe in god and science at the same time. Science has proven to me that god does not exist. Some people do not believe in god because o god does not believe in homosexuality or abortion.
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These people can think independently and do not need a book or belief to guide them through life. People have morals instilled with them by their family and friends and not by a book or a belief. You can be a successful and moral person and not believe in religion.
It isn’t very christian of you to judge others. I do not judge you for being a christian. I just believe forcing your beliefs on others is wrong!
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A new awesome height of absurdity: “Why do you think Jesus is made to exalt the poor and chastise the rich? It’s a great come-on for proselityzing. ”
So, Jesus talked about the poor and the kingdom of heaven literally as a “come-on”? So, you are literally claiming that he was using false advertising and misspeaking to get people in to give them the true message. Yes, this might fly with some modern money-oriented denominations of “Christianity” but no version of the faith I am aware of spurns the teachings of Christ so boldly.
But it is awesome in the breadth of its contempt for Christ’s stated teachings.
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Whups, that was meant to be in response to Gene Dubois’s little claim that Christ was actually a huckster trying to draw in the rubes.
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The atheists here can’t come up with a single core belief yet claim to be “moral”, whatever that means to them. They show no hesitancy to condemn anyone that would embrace any hint of a set of core moral beliefs, The Ten Commandments for instance. Their banter only re-inforces my perception that their main desire is to prove to themselves who may be the most un-Christian and revel in the fact they aren’t like what they believe to be nasty stupid Christians.
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“Smart”imus – repeating this silliness does not make you right.
So, I challenge you again, state ONE core belief that ALL Christians hold. Just one. You mention the 10 commandments. Which ones? There are 3 different versions. Which of them is an absolute? Thou shalt not kill/murder? Some sects of Christianity see it as an absolute even when it comes to self defense. Others make allowances for killing under circumstances such as self defense or to save lives.
The pope gave indulgences to not only kill but to covet, commit adultery, steal, etc. to individuals who went on the crusades. Do YOU keep the sabbath as outlined in the Bible? In Jewish tradition no work is a very strong notion, which has led to some odd inventions to allow people to do things without actually “working” (not sure if I think this workaround is valid, but hey, not my religion).
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All people that claim to be Christians aren’t necessarily Christians so those that only claim to be Christians would have a different view.
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Excellent, this leads to an obvious question – who gets to decide who the “actual” Christians are? *YOU*? Seems like a lot of the people who claim to know what it truly is to be Christian have other agendas that do not seem to jibe with Christ’s teachings.
So, implicitly you are conceding that since we cannot truly identify Christians, since viewpoints on what makes a Christian varies, that the notion of any unifying core belief is impossible to find. So, it would follow that atheists also not having any unifying core belief does not in any way make them different from Christians. Can we assume that you will now stop railing against “the atheists” for this reason???
BTW, seems like you have much more interesting groups to go after, how about Christians like me who find many of your views decidedly non-Christian??
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I’ll stop railing against atheists when you stop railing against Christians. I believe God will seperate the wheat from the chaff in the end. There is no denying that there are core Christian beliefs common to all Christians but I’m not going to be judging anyone at the end. I’ll be looking for mercy.
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I don’t rail against Christians or really anyone. I do find myself enjoying poking people for their hypocrisy, and many “Christ”ians seem to enjoy climbing up on a pedestal, so its hard not to needle. Jim Bakker (with Jessica Hahn), Jimmy Swaggart (and his prostitutes), Ted Haggard (with male prostitutes), Marcus Lamb (and his affairs), the Catholic church and its ongoing pedophilia problem (see what is happening in LA for example), etc. Its odd how often modern “Christ”ians, Republicans, and others who have large power bases spend so much time wailing about how they are put upon. Perhaps you might want to review Matthew 5:38-39.
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@”Smart”imus – you have been challenged on this a number of times. You keep asking for responses and keep ignoring the responses, not sure why (trying to channel Glenn Beck?). You have this weird notion that there is some group out there called “the atheists.” Do you imagine they have clubs or big organizations?? Less than 2% of the US population classifies itself as agnostic or atheist. Contrast that with over 70% of the US identifying themselves as Christian.
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The claim has been made that atheists are equally as moral as Christians but even you admit that atheists are a diverse group that no one can really define. The comparison is therefore baseless.
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Well, you have come full circle having just invalidated your own argument. Congratulations.
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Of course that statement is ridiculous but at least you’re not equating me to the KKK like some others. Many atheists spend most of their time trying to tear Christians down rather than proclaim their, however erroneous, view of how atheism is the epitomy of righteousness. If atheists want to be atheists, have at it.
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Actually, atheists do not spend much time tearing anybody down. The opposite of love is not hate, it’s indifference. That means most atheists could care less what you or any other Christian believes. Atheists are having a good day when you are obsessing over their imagined preoccupation with your religious life. You need a hobby, Smartmouse.
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That may be true, but of course that doesn’t apply to most of the atheists commenting here. As far as me “obsessing”, this is just a hobby.
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You are the only one trying to prove christians have more morality than non christians. My argument is you do not need to have a religion to have a set of morals. This concept seems to make your mind explode. Religion can be a great thing, it teaches some great concepts, but you do not neeed tobelieve in the bible to have morals. For you your religion has installed in yourself a core value of beliefs. For myself I did not need religion, my family members taught me right from wrong, my individual thought has allowed me to decide the right choices throughout my life. You truly need to study your bible if you believe you are better than your neighbor.
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Please point out where I’ve said I’m better than anyone? I just don’t subscribe to your way of thinking. I have no less right to challenge your philosophy than you do mine.
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