Sanford Health to hire 2 Native American healers
January 2, 2013 at 7:06 am in Grand Forks Herald
The country’s largest rural, nonprofit hospital system is hiring two traditional Native American healers to train medical staff in the Dakotas and Minnesota in an effort to better serve the American Indian patient population. Continue Reading
When are they planning on hiring two certified Catholic exorcists?
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That is the across town rival
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Is this what we can expect with Obamacare? Forget the expensive operation, our resident medicine man is going to come in and see if blowing smoke in your face can cure you. Forget antibiotics, see if sucking on this tree root helps.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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I am sure that one of provisions in Obamacare is that Sanford Health in Grand Forks, ND has to hire 2 native healers.
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Having been a “guest” in a Sanford Hospital within the past few years, I’d have to say that a Native healer would be a step up.
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Let’s just go back to the days where the doctor gave you a bottle of laudanum and sent you home.
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Devil: what do you think they do now? Laudanum = opium OxyContin = opium on steroids
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Kids … dad’s home. The fun is over.
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I’ve got a “novel” idea…
How about if you want this, you get it and that cost is added to YOUR bill? I don’t want it and there is no way in 7734 that I should have to pay for something like this. It has ZERO value to me. If it has a value to you then great, ask for it and pay for it.
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How is it added to your bill? If you never use the radiation therapy the hospital has available you don’t want to pay for that overhead either?
Put your big boy pants on & grow up
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How long until Altru follows suit?
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First, another hospital announces it will open in Grand Forks with shamans avaiable for Native patients. Then Altru goes to the city council and arranges the opening to be blocked. Then Altru kidnaps the shamans.
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Knowing human nature, this should open the door to the demands of Druids, Wiccans, Animists, and others that they have access to their “healers.”
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Why not. They’re not as mercenary as big pharma, insurance and hospital corporations in driving up medical costs.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Maybe Sanford can set aside a room to house the sacrificial chickens for follwers of Santería.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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You gotta bring your own chickens….
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You’re in your element on this topic huh Gene…..Enjoy…
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I don’t want a Native American healer, I want my regular witch doctor.
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OO-EE-OO-AH-AH-TING-TANG WALLA-WALLA BING-BANG.
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Oooooh, I feel better already!
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excellent smartie …
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When you break it all down, this is nothing but a PR ploy, so Sanford can say “See how PC we are? We embrace multiculturalism and diversity.”
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I think it will be pretty hard to make a malpractice case on the Native American healer or any other witch doctor because they make their own rules.
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They’ll get them for chanting without a license. A Class B misdemeanor.
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Who pays the bill when many Native Americans get medical treatment? Who’s money is Sanford really going after? I’m left to wonder about this.
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Indian Health Service pays at Medicaid rates. Anyone who builds a business model on IHS is soon out of business
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His given name was Johnny Longfeather until they used that stone flint knife to circumcise him.
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another little johnny joke…
A teacher notices that little Johnny at the back of the room is squirming around, scratching himself, and not paying attention.
She goes back to find out what’s up. He’s quite embarrassed. He whispers that he has just recently been circumcised and he’s quite itchy.
The teacher tells him to go down to the principal’s office, to call his mom, and ask her what he should do.
He does this and returns to class, sits down in his seat and suddenly, there is a commotion from the back of the room.
Back down she goes, only to find him sitting in his seat with his pants unzipped.
“I thought I told you to call your mom?” She says.
“I did” he says, “She told me if I could stick it out until noon she would come and get me.”
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You guys crack me up. Back in the Stone Age when I was in nursing school we had a Native patient that refused to have surgery until a healer blessed the OR. Not one to let her schedule come unraveled, the charge nurse called Pastoral Care who found a healer who came in & blessed the room. We did a quick re clean & did the surgery.
As for Gene’s smart aleck Wiccan comment, there is one on call.
Hospitals have been working with people’s various faith traditions forever. Nurses are required by law to deal holistically with our patients (it is in the Nurse Practice Act). I don’t get to decide right/wrong. If you want crystals at your bedside to channel whatever it is they channel – I’m on it.
I had never met a Buddhist Monk before a very cute little wrinkled old Asian woman came in to die & her family requested one. He came up from Fargo.
The hardest thing to get in GF used to be a Rabbi. Not sure if that is still the case
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Thank you for correcting my homework. Good night dad.
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More lack of your GF historical knowledge and attempts to make it seem like a backwater. There used to be the largest Jewish neighborhood in GF between Seattle & Mpls. 300 families with a synagogue until the 60s.
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1. That was 50 years ago.
2. What happened? Why did they leave?
GF used to only have a “reader” when I worked at Altru (a lay religious leader). If you needed a Rabbi he had to come from Fargo. I don’t know if we have our own now.
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Beth-El used to bring a rabbinical student from Chicago during High Holy Days. Don’t know if it still does.
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What everyone is missing is the tone of several of the responses above. It seems they believe the First Amendment applies only to Christians (maybe monotheists in general if you downplay Islam).
While I do not agree with their beliefs, I am a little taken aback by people’s hostile reaction to them. Believing your belief is right and everyone else’s is wrong is why we have the First Amendment: so such beliefs do not influence policy.
The question to ask yourself: if this article had been about Sanford hiring two Catholic Priests, or Protestant Ministers for their pastoral care department, would it have generated the same amount of controversy?
If the answer is no, you need to ask yourself if you honestly believe in our system of government or not? Remember: the First Amendment was not written to protect government from religion, but to protect religion (especially the ones we do not agree with) from government.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Well said. The upper Midwest is generally Christian-centric, and even in some cases, Lutheran-centric. How many times have I read a letter to the editor that quotes the bible as if that were the end of the story. There are many people here who have not traveled much especially outside the US.
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Biblical quotes suffer from at least two problems: they are torn out of context, and they are not in the original languages, which means you are citing a translator’s interpretation of the text.
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” the First Amendment was not written to protect government from religion, but to protect religion (especially the ones we do not agree with) from government.”
I’d say it was reciprocol: Freedom OF and FROM religion.
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I could agree with that. The powers of government are insidious, that is why government can and should be respected, but never trusted.
In the US the government is the largest insurance provider by a factor of 10. BCBS is an afterthought in comparison. For the government to say we will pay for Pastoral Care as long as it conforms to societal norms, but not that which is outside those norms (spiritualists, animists, Wiccan, etc) is in fact a way for the government to endorse monotheism over every other type of religion, including no religion.
Again, insidious and very very powerful. Government sanction carries a huge amount of weight.
For that reason it has to be all or nothing. You respect and encourage all faith traditions, or none; and since faith is a major component of many people’s coping, doing away with it causes real physical harm.
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Every time I hear someone say something like Christianity is under attack because people are rejecting the all encompassing nature of their trying to make everyone think like them…….I too think of the “Freedom From Religion” aspect that they seem to be overlooking in their rush to make everyone part of the Christian way. You have a right to your beliefs and I have a right to be a heathen
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So why then are you attacking their right to express their beliefs? You have the right to reject religion if you desire. Oh, I get it, you are giving lip-service to freedom of speech.
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It depends where. Just like smokers…I don’t care if you smoke until you try to smoke around me. If the expression is in an appropriate setting then go to it all you want. If you’re going to insist you way or the highway….Tell it to the Taliban….They believe that way too
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So if I want to sacrifice a goat maybe a chicken depends on the amount of work i’m having done in the OR i can?
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None: if you have enough $ you can do whatever you want. Do you have any idea how many expectant mothers had their babies someplace other than where they planned because Beyonse took up half a floor?
I am sure sacrificing a goat or two would be child’s play
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You don’t kid around.
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Good one. 2 points
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I have pocket full of lemons and they all taste the same. Is that enough?
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It seems like many of the posters on this subject could use a little healing of some kind. Perhaps an Native American healer is just what they need to have a more positive attitude about the customs of other cultures.
At one time, acupuncture was viewed as a bunch of quackery but it is widely accepted now as a pain control tool. If these healers can assist people in dealing with thier afflictions without just giving them an off the shelf prescription I am all for it.
Native American remedies are most likley much older than most of the medicine practiced today by Western doctors. If they work why not use them? Oh, and I’m not sure Obama has anything to do with this local hospitol initiative.
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One huge difference is that acupuncture and pressure have been scientifically proven to have actual health applications. That’s why in some cases they can even use in in surgery while keeping the person awake. I don’t know a lot about the spiritual healers, but I suspect it’s more of a psychological comfort and an assist to inner strength to fight an illness or whatever might be effecting you. Indeed that can be very powerful. But I’m pretty sure that it’s psychological and not physical healing like Acura puncture and pressure
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Tundra, categorical proof is pretty hard to establish in science — so it’s all about the strength of the evidence. In the case of acupuncture, very dubious evidence has been elevated to “proof” by the “alternative medicine” marketing machine!
Arguably, the world’s best researcher of (so called) “alternative and complementary medicine” is Edzard Ernst. You can see what he has to say about acupuncture at: http://edzardernst.com/category/acupuncture/
BTW, the notion that acupuncture could be used as an anesthetic for surgery came from what a team that visited Maoist China witnessed there. The Chinese have since admitted that it was a scam.
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I thought I saw an American doctor doing some brain surgery using acupuncture. I remember the idea was to be able to have the patient describe what they felt or such to know what part of the brain was being effected. I could be wrong because it was something I saw quite a while ago so I’m not too sure.
I wonder if acupuncture actually helped Clapton kick heroine’s withdrawal then?
I thought acupuncture had been studied and found to be scientifically true to some extent…..Damn rumors
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Oh hell…I guess pressure points are only good for self defense then. Bummer….I really thought both the pressure and puncture were gods for you…..
Damn you Justasec….Now I can’t turn to those for some real bliss in times of stress. I do have an app that has different algorithms for different levels of relaxation or sleep. I suppose you’ll tell me that’s just in my mind too huh?
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The problem with studying things like acupuncture is the difficulty of conducting an experimental test that is free of bias. That’s easy with something like a pharmaceutical because placebo capsules can be easily used to “blind” the research. The gold standard study is where the person who administers the treatments also doesn’t know which is placebo or not — that’s a “double blind” study. Sham acupuncture needles have been invented, but cannot easily be used double blind. That’s probably why there’s often a little difference (of no practical significance) between “sham” and actual acupuncture when they are tested.
The other problem is the fallacy of results from several studies that have contrasted usual care with usual care plus acupuncture. Often the addition of acupuncture yields improved results — but the question is why? Since acupuncturists are usually very caring and reassuring, it’s almost certainly the extra care and reassurance that makes the difference — not the acupuncture! The alt-med marketing machine doesn’t tell you that!
Acupuncture, like any physical stimulus, will increase endorphin output in the body. The levels of change are unlikely to make much difference — and since you could get a higher endorphin production by tweaking your butt hard, the needles and high costs are not needed.
BTW, I’m not planning on opening the Justasec butt tweaking clinic any time soon!
Tundra, some light-to-moderate exercise, good music, and a sauna or massage will get the kinks out of your truckin’ carcass much better! A moderate shot of barley elixir might help too if you are not driving your rig afterwards.
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Thanks FN for pointing out the obvious (a few comments above).
This is essentially no different than having chaplains in hospitals or the military. Many of the comments above simply demonstrated why religion is such a divisive influence in society. People will jealously defend their own delusions while being quite derogatory about those held by others.
As for bogus medicine — hospitals (being businesses by and large) will provide whatever nonsense their patients (consumers) demand — so you’ll easily find nonsense such as “therapeutic touch, acupuncture, homeopathy,” and chiropractic.
We need evidence-based medicine and a single payer system!
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It’s not complicated with the hiring the native healers. It’s marketing- there’s nothing wrong with that. However, I always enjoy the wacky religious and anti-Obamacare comments.
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