Obama says he ‘won’t compromise’ on taxes
December 10, 2012 at 8:00 am in Grand Forks Herald
President Barack Obama says he “won’t compromise” on his demands that the wealthiest Americans pay more in taxes. However, Obama held back from directly criticizing Republicans for opposing his tax plans. Continue Reading
So much for compromise. Obama is holding one card so I suppose he can’t give in because then he would have no boogeyman to blame for his catastrophic failure as president.
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Smartypants: I know Americans are fickle and occasionally do not do their homework, but do you believe reelection by the largest electoral margin in 25 years means the majority of the country feels his Presidency is a catastrophic failure? I think you are taking your own feelings and generalizing a tad too far
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What Obama and the democrats are doing to the country with out of control spending is catastrophic. There is no chance of a fovorable end result.
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Obama’s policies are simply the looting of the treasury.
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There is no money in the treasury, he can’t be raiding that.
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He borrows it from the Chinese, prints as much as he can, then loots it.
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The Lord giveth and Obama taketh away.
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How can Bush even enter into the conversation at this point after the Obama fiasco of almost $6 trillion in four years. The fact is I didn’t support Bush on his overspending to appease the democrats but I did support him on his war efforts. The democrats supported him too in the early going but saw political advantage for themselves in supporting our enemies instead later on.
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Do forget the he is re-distribute other hard earned money on the sick lame and the lazy.
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Dont mind the sick and lame getting a little redistribution. But those who are just lazy…. kick them to the curb.
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It tells me a large portion of America wants free stuff.
GOP wont give you free stuff.
Thats why you have such a huge margin of victory.
Does that make you proud somehow?
Is that what you see as making this nation great?
Sad
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Obama and W Bush are among the worst Presidents that we have ever had. Certainly the worst consecutive bad Presidents in our history. But even Obama has “only” a 50% or so disapproval rating. The problem lies with the folks who have a 9% approval rating. Yet for some reason, the sheep re-elect folks like the Boehners, Pelosis, Reids and McConnells of the world.
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Correct. Everyone hates Congress but the surest way to get elected is to be an incumbent. When it comes to politics people do not think, they feel. They also do not vote for something, they vote against something else. Political Scientists have known this forever and it is the reason why no matter how much people complain about negative campaigns, they work.
Look at Heidi and Berg or Barry and Romney. In each case one group succeeded in painting a picture of the other guy that was only marginally correct, but none the less very effective.
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I get a kick out of the class card the Dems play. Obama, Pelosi, Reid are all multi-millionaires; Reid and Pelosi worth over $100 million. And they attack the rich?
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How do you come up with that bit of brilliance from what he posted? You might as well have said something like “Rutabegga” for as much relevance.
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giving free stuff to their voters isnt in their best interest?
Give it a rest.
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Well Obama won the election with just over 50% of the popular vote. So I think it more accurate to state that 51% of the people agree with him not 65%. Just raising taxes is NOT going to solve our deficit spending. We need to significantly cut spending. Lets start with cutting all Federal elected and appointed officials wages and benefits by 25% until the budget is balanced. Bet it becomes a real priority then.
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That’s why spending cuts are in the Democratic plan. Of course, taxing the rich won’t get it all done, but why shouldn’t they do their part like everybody else?
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The spending cuts they proposed do not amount to a spit in the ocean. They are only token cuts so the dems can say look we are cutting spending.
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Realist, President Obama’s proposal boils down to raising taxes and waiting to discuss any substantive spending cuts. The increased taxes amount to under 10% of the annual budget deficit. While many people are obsessed with “taxing the rich”, the reality is that the increased taxes will cover only a nominal portion of the deficit. Many people favor the tax increases for a variety of reasons including the mistaken belief it will resolve the budget deficit, the fact that the increases take from others and not them and simple envy of others.
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Realist is accurate: 65% of Americans agree with raising the taxes on the rich. That is much different than the 47% the fox news crowd keeps toting as the cause of all of America’s problems.
That is not to say 65% believe in across the board tax increases, just restoring taxes to where they were when the country was still prosperous.
80% of Americans like doing away with preexisting conditions and keeping your kids on your insurance until 26. That is not to say 80% of Americans agree with everything Obamacare is proposing.
Despite what the pundits think, Americans are smart enough to pick and choose which party policies they agree with and which they reject.
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Winning states like California, and New York will get you a lot of electoral votes but these are also the states that are bankrupt socially and fiscally.
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He ran his campaign promising to continue to give things to those that vote for him.
There are two groups of voters in this country, those that work, and those that live off those that work.
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Well of course he’s not going to compromise. The prog definition of ‘bipartisan’ is ‘Republicans agreeing to whatever a Democrat wants’. He has not compromised in the last 4 years — why should he start now? It seems to be working for him. The sheep will blame the Republicans no matter what happens. If the Republicans agree to rasing taxes on the 2%, Obama (and his media minions) will say the Republicans wouldn’t bargain about the loopholes and deductions, and are only out to protect ‘the rich.’ I believe we have reached the tipping point, where 50+% of the people will vote themselves goodies from the public trough. If you tax Peter to give Paul a handout, you can always count on Paul’s vote. That what the Dems have been doing for years. The Pauls in this country now outnumber the Peters. The next stage is not going to be pretty.
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The “sheep”? LOL! The sheep are those who think that their party has all the answers. Obama should not have been reelected. And why did we send Boehner and Pelosi back into office? Baaa. Baaa. Democrats bad. Baaa. Baaa Republicans bad. “I saw it on MSNBC”. Baa. Baa. “I saw it on Fox” Baaa. Baaa.
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HighPlainsDrifter, you are exactly right on!!
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I don’t think raising taxes for the upper class will solve our problems. The problem is SPENDING! But anywho if BO wants to raise taxes, then don’t discriminate, raise taxes across the board. Everybody chips in, I am not rich but I am willing to chip in my share.
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You could tax everyone in this country at 100% and still not wipe out the real debt, which some have estimated at 85 trillion, based on considerations that are never made public. This financial cliff business ia just another dog and pony show put on by politicians. Once they have their fill of camera time they will make an agreement.
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Start selling the federal assets.
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We have been discussing that on another thread Kevin. Mention surplus military infrastructure and the world goes wild. NIMBY is alive and well. Cut everyone else’s time at the federal teat, but leave mine alone.
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I’d put in a bid for the Da Vinci painting in the National Gallery.
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$85 ttttttttTRILLION Gene? In that case, print money to infinity and beyond. Then pass the massive debt on to our grandchildren’s grandchildren. Keep the party rolling boys.
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Unfortunately Gene is correct.
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That is exactly how we got here. As I mentioned before, every single congress since 1968 has known that entitlement spending would bankrupt the country sometime in the 21 century. Since that is long after they were going to be retired, they kicked the can down the road.
Now it is the 21 century, the people responsible for the debacle are crying for their benefits and the rest of us are supposed to pay for their malfeasance.
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85 trillion? According to CNN Mr. Obama wants to cut the deficit by only 4 trillion over the next ten years. I want a new leader.
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I believe the $85,000,000,000,000 Gene is referring to are unfunded promises or mandates from pensions to healthcare. It is well over $1,000,000 for a family of four. Yes, we need leadership.
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Realist says, “Democrats have nothing against the rich.” That might be true, but President Obama seems to hate all the large employers. I’m one of the dinosaurs (Republicans) who feel that business (including big business) was THE engine that created jobs while furthering the interests of the poor and unemployed. President Obama is one of the most eloquent public speakers on the planet, but also very hateful of successful businessmen. People who feel the way I do are a thing of the past. It honestly keeps me awake at night.
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He’s not that eloquent; if he doesn’t have a teleprompter, he stammers and stutters on a par with little Lord Pomeroy.
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I should have used “effective” rather than eloquent. sorry.
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This is one of those myths it is impossible to put to death. Obama is NOT against big business or small business, for that matter. Corporate profits are through the roof. When will you guys who hate Dems realize that you are being bamboozled into thinking that big money corporate interests are best for America? The big money is having it’s way and the real problem is the working class being left in the dust.
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It doesn’t do any good to demonize either big business or Obama. The fact is, nearly everyone has literally a vested interest in corporations and their success through their various pension plans, not to mention individual portfolios.
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That’s reasonable, but the demonizing starts at the top. Remember Nancy Pelosi, in front of Congress, referring to the “greedy insurance companies?” In almost the next breath she speaks of compromise. My side thinks the insurance companies are our best voice and have their customers’ best interest in mind. Where’s the middle ground?
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If you think insurance companies are our “best voice” then you have never been in an automobile accident and seen your premiums to up the next month in an amount that covers the cost of your reimbursement from the company within a year’s time.
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My goodness, big insurance was just a reference to the demonizing Gene mentioned. Also, to suggest surcharges for the accident prone repay an entire claim is just silly talk. It’s so much more complicated than you make it. Clearly, you have no problem with Pelosi’s assessment. Well, there it is.
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I’m just calling a spade, a spade. Insurance companies have figured out that they can transfer the “insurance” risk to buyers of insurance. Clearly you have not had a fender bender recently.
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You have completely missed my point. I believe insurance and utility companies and most big business take care of their customers first. You and Pelosi disagree. You only see the part of the iceberg sticking out of the water. It’s your right. Alvin disengaging.
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That’s right, to a degree. It’s the “corporations are people” argument that Romney used. Of course, we need our investments to do well and they did do well, for example, under the Clinton administration when corporate taxes were higher. My beef is with the argument that is made by my Republican friends that all you have to do is make sure business gets their tax cuts and somehow, magically, and counter to past history, we in the middle class will benefit by seeing out wages and opportunities increase. That has not happened so a differenct approach is necessay.
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I saw on the news last week that corporate profits are at record highs, make them pay their fair share! Wages aren”t reflecting corporate profits so at least help pay down the deficit so the working stiffs can keep what little we have rather than less by higher taxes.
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Corporations simply pass their taxes on to the consumer. In addition, they have over a trillion off shore, due to the corporate tax structure in the US. Lower that, they’ll repatriate that money.
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Holy smokes, Gene. You said a mouthful. Very efficient. Two thumbs up!!!!
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All I hear is tax the people more, nothing about tax the Chinese imports more, tax the oil exported from the US more….
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Oh, yes. YES YES YES.
You have absolutely nailed it. Thank you.
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Let me get this straight Bob: it is the Chinese imports that are the cause of our problems? And if we put a tariff on these imports America will become more competitive?
If I remember correctly the big 3 auto makers said the same thing about Japanese cars in the 70s. It never crossed their minds that the Japanese cars were actually better as well as cheaper. They kept telling themselves the problem was elsewhere instead of in the mirror to the point that an entire segment of the American economy went belly up and entire swaths of the country (the rust belt) went headfirst into a depression.
Protectionism is not what is needed. Sound economic policy is what is needed. The only reason China imports cheap trash is Americans want cheap trash.
The problem is not across the ocean; it is in the mirror
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Good Idea Bob, tax everything 20% coming from china and tax any fuel export from this country. Something has to be done since the good jobs are going overseas. There must be no income tax increase in this country or there will be job cuts, further hurting the country, less spending from individuals if they have to pay more taxes, further damaging the economy. Government must quit sending money oversea’s and cutting spending. I would be in favor to Impeach Obama.
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I thought conservatives were pro free market? Or is that only if we are winning?
You need to go check out a history book. Protectionism has hurt every country who has ever practiced it. Start with the Townshend Acts in 16 century England.
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I am a conservative, but free market only works if there is a full level playing field. where labor, shipping costs are all the same, but we can’t compete with oversea’s labor practices, so we should be having an import tax on any product from any country with wages under our own country’s set min. wage. There is one I was hoping to run for president that i know would have fixed this country, but he dropped out due to his dislike of a few fatheads running on the republican ticket.
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Slick Willie signed NAFTA. Since then good paying mfg jobs are going to Mexico. The middle class has been destroyed. Once the illegals get their amnesty wages will go down even more. Barry wants a third world nation and he is bringing us closer to that reality every day.
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Phil,
You complain about NAFTA (which has been a huge economic success overall) yet insist on buying your staples at WalMart prices. You cannot have it both ways. You cannot have cheap, affordable, clothes, shoes, food, and household goods on one hand and then complain about how they got there on the other.
The American worker lost because they thought a manufacturing job which required no training was worth $20 an hour and full bennies (100% company paid). The Big 3 auto makers did not implode because of foreign competition, they imploded (almost taking the entire US economy with them) because they thought they were immune to market forces. They thought Americans would buy whatever pieces of trash they produced (remember K cars) and be thankful for it.
The auto industry had thirty years notice that change was afoot and chose to ignore it. Instead of restructuring their labor contracts and retooling their factories, they sat on their hands. Detroit and the rust belt are the end result.
American textiles followed a similar path. They too had decades to renegotiate, retool, and prepare. Can you even buy a shirt that is made in America anymore?
The problem is not just cheap foreign labor, the problem is people who do not want to make the changes needed to still be around in 10 years.
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NAFTA is mixed, but overall, I would rather have it made in Mexico than China or any other Asian country. The shipping is much cheaper from Mexico or Canada. Think of all the wasted fuel on stuff imported from China. Putting a tax on oversea’s Imports would be a win-win, even for the greenhouse emission groups in hopes that companies bring jobs back here.
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Because they think that one day they may be rich instead of admitting that they are poor and it is not going to get better.
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John: I’m not sure I’ve met anyone who is more opposite than me until I read your comment. It’s the Democrats who forced jobs overseas. Your kind has created 9 cent electricity while China pollutes our earth with 2 cent power (one example). You are for wind and solar energy no matter what the cost. Forget tax rates. Your philosophy has bankrupted our nation. Republicans are for the poor, through capital reinvestment and job reation. Clearly, you hate my line of thinking, but we simply have opposite philosophies. In a way, I don’t understand the hate, but on another level, I feel sorry for you for hating what you don’t understand. The hardest thing for me is that your way is much more popular than mine. It’s not easy being conservative in today’s USA.
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People from our neck of the woods generally don’t realize how completely in the minority they are as conservatives. Huge segments of the population agree with the progressives to a greater extent than with conservatives. The last election told us why. Conservatism has turned ugly in this country with policies that repel women, working people, Latinos, people of color including Asians, professional people, educated people, people having no church affiliation, gay and lesbian people and young people. Conservatives have a lock on aging white men and old people as well as evangelical christians. The amazing thing is that so many conservatives just can’t understand that what they stand for is not appealing to the majority. You actually have conservatives saying they need to be more conservative in reaction to the last election. Well, good luck with that. The GOP is in a very dark place right now. They will stay there unless they realize the policies they promote are nonstarters with the majority of the people.
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Conservatism has not turned ugly. The organized propaganda for the huge majority if the media in this county has simply changed how people see conservatives. If the press would report to the true issues instead of twisting it to fill their sensationalist agenda and political orientation it would not be so. A freedom of religion issue forced by this administration suddenly became a war on women in the press. It will be interesting to see how or if the press reports on the union violence happening in this country right now. I bet it will be presented as these poor down trodden workers picked on by business. Not the violent criminal union members attacking innocent people.
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You can’t just blame the media. People have a way of getting at the truth of the matter. It’s clear that Romney was defeated fair and square by people who saw through his talking points. The idea that you have promoted, that nothing at all is wrong with conservative policy, but it’s all the fault of the media just doesn’t pass the smell test. Face it, people just don’t agree with your policy.
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Romney is not and has never been a conservative. No matter how much you try to sell that lie it will continue to be a lie. He did not have my support. Bush also was not a conservative.
As far as the people seeing through all the press propaganda you must have rose colored glasses on. None of the people I know who voted for Obama, and I know many, had any idea what policies of his they supported or even why the supported him other than they “liked” him.
I have no problem with the tax increases, in fact they are to low and should be across the board. But unless we make DRASTIC spending cuts what is coming to this country in the future will make the depression look like prosperous times. You just can not keep borrowing money forever, and both parties are responsible for this insanity. We keep this up and we will be seeing triple digit inflation per month.
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You are evading your prior statement blaming the media. Forget Romney. The problem was the GOP party platform that was against almost everybody who voted. The reason the platform was that way was to appease the conservatives.
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realist that is how the press presented the information. They turned many things around from something the GOP supported to people they were against and did a very good job against it. Show me where it stated we are having a war on women. That is what the press made of standing up for religious freedom. I am not evading everything if you read past posts I think you will find I am rather direct in my responses rather than attack others as you seem to do.
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Glen, A tax increase now will send this country deep into the pits, end up much worse off than ever in history. You can not raise taxes in any way during a depression. The only way is to cut wasteful spending and there is a-lot of it. The people of the U.S. can’t afford to pay more taxes. that money is going to pay off their own debt, items they buy which goes to sales tax revenues, when they buy, it makes demand for products that stores sell which keeps them open, paying workers. Take that money out of circulation, businesses will end up closing down, thus begins job losses on a wide scale, soon to follow, less tourism, states will be hurt from less tourism. It will be a downward spiral that would continue for years. Tax whats causing this in first place if have to, Chinese Imports! If companies can’t afford to import from china, they will start bringing work back to the states, that will increase the U.S. tax base which will increase revenue. Imagine how much better off this country would be if all our products were made here instead of China.
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You said a mouthful and your assessment of how many of these groups perceive the GOP is probably accurate. Many of us are conservative, not because of religion or most of the other things you mention, but because of commerce. We feel the government is the problem. Many of the groups you mention feel we aren’t governed enough. I truly believe a robust economy that’s good for business, all business, helps all of society. I’m okay that some risk takers and many of the rich are getting richer, just so long as they take their employees with them with fair pay and low unemployment rates. We really have no middle ground, do we.
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I am in agreement with much of what you say, however, your caveat about employers “taking their employees with them” to prosperity is a thing of the past. That’s the reason middle income Americans are losing ground. They have been left behind while corporate profits are going up. This redistibution of wealth from the middle class to the rich has been taking on speed to the point that if you compare wages of what people earned in the 1950′s and 60′s,to what they earn today, the middle class has lost ground while the profits earned by business have skyrocketed to levels never seen before. CEO salaries are higher by orders of magnitude over what was common years ago. The rich get richer has never been more true. Rather than pulling employees along, business has been encouraged to turn their workforces into minimum wage operations or have sought rock-bottom wage workers overseas. Tell me it isn’t so. I’d love to hear it. But that is exactly what is happening. The business model you describe which has a business owner giving employees rewards for helping him succeed is gone forever. Meanwhile, these same business owners are crying foul when it comes to either employing a union workforce or being forced to pay a fair income tax. Business has become ruthless in a way that is not good for our society.
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A good part of what you speak of is simply due to the fact that Americans are no longer competing with Americans for many of those jobs. We are competing with people who are willing to work for $10 a day. There is no way we can change that so we as a country have to learn to adapt to it. As the globe continues to become more industrial and tech skills we will have more and more competition that is willing to work for those lower wages and the jobs will continue to move there.
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In addition to returning the tax rates on the $250k plus, and a huge reduction in spending by the Dems, the Republicans must be convinced to stop voting for tax incentives to ship jobs overseas.
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that is a very small part of the reason jobs are moving overseas. 50 years ago no one else in the world had the skilled workforce the USA had. They could not compete because they could not do the work. Now they can. They have the skills and the willingness to work for far smaller wages. Any tax breaks we have given are a joke compared to that. Not only to the companies save with these lower wages but also with lower taxes. We see it right here in this country with companies moving to states with lower taxes and right to work laws. It will continue because most of it we have no control over.
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Well put Glen (one n); you are absolutely correct. As I stated above, unions believe a job requiring a HS diploma is worth $20 an hour and full bennies (100% company paid). There are workers overseas who disagree.
America has strengths no country on the planet can match. If we wish to survive we must learn to maximize those while retooling our economy. Bruce Springstein said it best 30 years ago: “those jobs are going boys and they aren’t coming back.”
We have had 30 years worth of warning. It is very difficult to blame the boogey man if we are now caught with our pants down, unprepared for the new reality. It is not like we did not know it was coming
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Glen, The unions are the root cause of companies moving oversea’s in the first place. The best thing to happen is Right To Work Laws, but do I blame a company to be in a state of lower taxes, no, it makes good business sense to do so. Any company now has the sense not to put a factory in a non right to work state to avoid strikes or being stuck with a bad worker that they cant fire.
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Companies blame unions when they move out of this country but the real reason is to get away from paying healthcare costs. Also I have read a great deal about companies in the US who have taken advantage of J1 visas to import labor into this country to once again avoid paying healthcare costs.
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“realist” I don’t see it the way you are characterizing it at all. I put 90% our situation on the government making impossible rules that stifle every aspect of commerce. Jobs are overseas because our government has broken the camel’s back and made it impossible for businessmen not to downsize. Big business will downsize, cut, skimp and scrape because they are for profit. There might be record profits in healthcare, agriculture, etc., but basic companies such as UPS or retailers all over are suffering. Unemployment isn’t big businesses’ fault, it’s largely the fault of gov’t interference in commerce. Forget about the 1950′s when we were killing our air and water. I want the 1990′s regulations when we’d fixed 90% of those problems. Now the third world has the manufacturing with a 1950′s attitude about our earth. Sadly, people like you turn to Washington, the very culprit that’s put us here. Again, you and I are opposites.
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I run a small business and the big government regulations argument just isn’t true. Sure, there are standards for certain things, but overall businesses can do what they want. This stuff about regulations stifling business is just a bunch of hyped up Faux news talking points that fall into the category of “if you repeat something often enough, people think it’s true” . The last place I turn to is Washington for anything. My business is successful because of how I have designed it.
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What do you mean you designed it? Obama says “you didn’t do that”.
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No, your business is successful because of all the infrastructure Obama built around it. And you did not pay for that infrastructure. even though I am sure you had to pay taxes(income, property, sales, FICA……)
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I can see that you are more interested in throwing political partisan punches than discussing this issue. I’m done…
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realist: most of your comments are about you, how you had a fender bender and the insurance company surcharges were more than the claim. It’s not fox news we are quoting. So you run a shoe repair or a gift shop, that’s not what I’m talking about. Try running a power company. Wholesale electricity is going up at 10 times the inflation rate some years. You chirp about fox news, but you are just as cliche. I am also done here.
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Realist, please tell us more about your business. How many employees do you have other than you and/or family members? Do you provide your employees with a health plan (not you or your family members, actual third person employees)? Do you provide a retirement plan? In several posts you have mentioned that you run a “small business” but you’ve never given any context to your statement. The a significant range “small businesses”.
I also think your statement that “the last place I turn to is Washington for anything” is incredible given the literally hundreds of posts you have typed lauding the virtue of the new Healthcare Act, your calls to “tax the rich”, your defense of long-term care assistance through Medicaid for people who have a million dollars in assets, the extension of guaranteed student loans and the multitude of similar posts supporting the expansion of just about every government program that is discussed. The further irony is that you have typed dozens of posts calling for the end of the “Bush tax cuts”, at times even blaming the economic downturn on those modifications of the tax code. Yet now those same tax provisions are apparently just fine with the exception of people making over $250,000; if you do the math you’ll discover that the vast majority of the reduced tax burden was provided to those earning less than $250,000.
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It id realativly simple, the republicans lost the election. The republicans main message was “obama’s redistribution of wealth is bad”. Sorry guys america did not buy into your smoke and mirrors. Your policies have failed america for the past 10 years! America is fed up with the top 1 percent getting away with destroying the middle class. The “new tax” is not new! It is eliminating TEMPORARY tax cuts and bringing them back to the same levels before bush was in office. America wants this to happen, we voted for it to happen in november.
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The democrats have been in control the last 6 years. They controlled Congress the last two years of the Bush administration and had complete control the first two years of the current Obama fiasco and still control the Senate with the Redistributer-in-Chief as President for four years. Add to that, President Bush wasn’t a fiscal conservative. How’s that working out for you?
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Obama can do nothing by himself. Congress has to agree. If you do not like the spending in Washington, you need to address Congress; not the President.
The President has the bully pulpit, but when it comes to spending that is all Congress.
A major reason we are where we are is Bush said if you do not question my wars, and pass all of the supplemental appropriations needed to run them, I will sign whatever spending bill you send my way.
They did and he did.
You reap what you sow…
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So Obama is lying about everything he says he’s going to do. That’s no surprise to me but I suppose it could le a shock to a lot of the lemmings on the left.
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The President cannot introduce one single spending bill in the House of Representatives (where all such bills must originate). He can Veto what they send him but he cannot force them to do anything.
If the President says we are going to do X, Y, & Z; what he really is saying is I’m going to ask for funding to carry out my grand schemes.
Ford wanted to go back into Vietnam before the fall of Saigon in 1975. Congress simply removed funding. No money, no troop movement.
Both sides bluster, but in the end its Congress that decides what gets spent.
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How is it then that George Bush is to blame for everything Obama claims to do, according to the left? President Bush could just as well have had a third term.
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It was not Bush’s economic or social policies that earned him the lowest approval ratings since Nixon, it was his foreign policy. Two wars conducted entirely off the books (supplemental appropriations) with no exit strategy and no hope of winning.
Afghanistan was almost inevitable after 9/11 but in the end, the same could have been accomplished with air power and special forces. Everyone, including the most hardened neo-cons agree that you will not be able to tell the US was ever there six months after we leave. We have spent over 10 years, $100 billions of dollars, and several thousand lives for a net gain of zero. Six months after we are gone women will be executed on the soccer pitch for infidelity, children will be married off to old men, girls will not be allowed in school, the economy will be non existent, elections will be a joke, and terrorists will once again use the mountains as training camps. Definitely money not well spent.
Iraq is much the same. We did not need to go there, and after we succeeded in getting rid of Saadam, we are no safer than we were before. In fact we may be worse. Iraq was all types of bad and no one misses Saadam, but he was a restraining force on Iran. That has now been removed.
Bush gets only the blame he deserves. He was a complete failure. The fact that I voted for him twice is among my greatest moments of shame.
If you include bailing out GOP contributors because they are “too big to fail” (a phrase that makes any true conservative nauseus) and trying to use mercenaries to do the US bidding (most of them paid by Cheyne’s old company Haliburton) you begin to realize he should have been impeached.
Bush One was a man of integrity. He won both of his wars. Junior was not up to the name.
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FN and all of congress Dem and Repub supported Bush with a declaration of war. He could NOT do it alone. As for exit strategy for Iraq Bush had a plan and agreement with the Iraqi governement when he left office. Guess what Obama followed it almost to the letter. The only change that occured is Bush’s plan left a number of advisors and legistical support personel in Iraq. After Obama was elected the Iraqi governement told Obama to get them out of the country also when we took out our combat troops. So he did.
Bush did make a mess out of Afie by religating it to the status of second class war interest.
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I agree Glen (one n) that Bush did not do it alone. That is why I did not vote for anyone who voted to go in. Where I disagree with you is the exit strategy. McCain thought we belonged there and had he been elected President we would still be there at pre-surg levels. If we had an exit strategy this is the first I have heard of it. It most certainly did not make it to Fox during the 2008 campaign.
As I said before, the Big O is the first time I have ever voted for a Dem for President. I do not agree with his major fiscal or social policy stances, but he said we would be out of Iraq. I feel cheated. We are still there.
We are leaving both Iraq and Afghanistan, but no where near fast enough.
As I said above, in 6 months you will not even know we were ever there. That is proof positive that no more time, treasure, or talent should be invested.
We achieved what we set out to do: kill Osama and dismantled most of Al Queda. They will be back. Staying there will not stop that.
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FN the plan was not finished being negotiated during the 2008 election. It was finished after Obama won but before he took office. And I am not shocked that you did not know of it because the press was busy peeing circles around Obama after the election. It was not a big story to them partly because they did not believe Obama would follow through with it.
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Obama wont compromise on taxes – this makes him a hero?
Congress wont compromise on spending cuts – this makes them Obstructionists?
Am i the only one who sees the hypocrisy in the Democrats way of thinking?
If Obama truly wanted to generate revenue, and he ONLY wanted to hit the top earners, he could very easily fix the tax code that is so corrupt and broken that it allows the rich to hide the vast majority of their wealth LEGALLY!
Until i see that happen, i dont believe a single word from any of these clowns.
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Capt give it a rest. I truely cannot believe that a man of your intellegence (no matter how whacked your views are) buys into such a rediculous and offensice excuse for the republicans loss in the past election.
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Captain and Smartimus: From an article in today’s Harald:
“Sara Stevenson spends her working hours surrounded by Republicans, namely the married men who work alongside her in a Denver oil and gas firm company. But after hours and on weekends, she usually spends her time with other single women, and there’s not a Republican in sight among the bunch.
“There was just no way I could have supported any Republican this year,” said Stevenson, 31. “They skew so much to the religious right. … They focused so much on taxes. It’s not something that women in my demographic really care about. I’ve never heard my friends lament their taxes.”
She is obviously one of the 47% you are talking about; a leach on society only interested in a handout. What are you doing to address her needs or are you just planning on continuing to ignore and try to marginalize those that don’t believe as you do?
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Free abortions, free birth control, Obamaphones, Taxing and spending without limit, what’s not to like? Obamaclaus, a socialist that just keeps on giving.
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Your willful ignorance of math will insure your continued marginalization. Single women = 1/4 of the electorate. No biggy, we don’t need them.
Hispanics, the fastest growing segment of the American populace. According to your own people you need at least 40% to win nationally. You only got 30% that agrees with you on social issues.
How exactly are you planning on retaking the White House?
You can blame everyone else forever, but in the end if the GOP crumbles it will be from the inside.
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From the inside is the only way you end any political party. Short of just killing all the members that is….. I do not think Obama would go that far in his quest for power.
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Agreed. No need for him to. The GOP is doing it to themselves. Hopefully that changes.
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The only thing that will cause the demise of the republican party is if they continue to try to be more like democrats. The left is assuming that everything is going to turn out just fine in the next four years.They believe that there is no need for restraint on anything of any kind. The answer to every problem is print or borrow more money and throw it at the problem and blame the republicans when the democrat program is a disaster. We are over the cliff. I anticipate Obama’s approval rating to be in single digits within three years.
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You very well could be right, but the GOP said the same thing the first time around. After 2010 they were predicting the Dems running Hillary because Barry would be so unpopular he wouldn’t survive the primaries.
Thank God these same people are not in charge of my 401 K
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I’ve heard some rumblings that Obama may be in charge of 401ks in the not too distant future. That’s not a happy thought.
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Atheist, Muslim, Christian, Jew…I’m asking everyone to capture the Christmas spirit. Watch the following youtube video. Then tell me this is not the season to give it a rest. Please, folks, let’s have some peace. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p05E_ohaQGk
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OOPS! I meant to post this to the Fargo church news piece.
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Holy smokes, three people disliked my reference to the Christmas Eve truce of 1914. Please, folks, I want to know you three. I have no idea what is wrong with a day of peace in the Western Front during WWI. Who are you three? Show your faces.
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