Many voters may be deterred by tough ID laws
July 9, 2012 at 2:43 am in Duluth News Tribune
Mississippi, South Carolina, Texas and Wisconsin are moving in that direction of having rules set for this year if they survive court challenges and federal approval. Continue Reading
I think this is a great idea. In today’s society, why wouldn’t people have a valid ID?! You need it for almost everything.
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almost everything except???…..voting for instance lol
Hot debate. What do you think?
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kamn,
In a free society, generally it is only car owners who really need to have a photo ID on a regular basis. My grandfather gets along just fine, and he almost never uses a photo ID. I know people with jobs who don’t drive and don’t show an ID to go to work or the grocery store. This isn’t Soviet Russia. People aren’t asked for their “papers” by KGB in a grocery store or in a park.
Mostly it is just people who drive cars that really need a photo ID on a regular basis. Do we really want to unnaturally favor car drivers as voters? Do we really want to exclude so many young and old folks who tend to not use cars.
8% of white Americans and 25% of black Americans who are all eligible to vote lack a photo ID. Do we really want to exclude those people? Rural people without cars might be hours away from a DMV.
To quote the NY Times:
““In West Texas, some people [who don't own any cars] would have a 200-mile round-trip drive” to the nearest state office to get a card, he testified, according to The Dallas Morning News. More than a quarter of the state’s counties don’t even have an office to get a driver’s license or voter card. Lines at the San Antonio motor vehicles offices are often more than two hours long, he said.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/14/opinion/voter-ids-on-trial-in-texas.html?_r=2&hp
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This is presented as a news story? From Associated Press? It sure reads like a viewpoint column.
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“A magician must cause a misdirection to distract you from seeing what he’s really doing to fool you into believing it’s really magic. A politician does the same thing and the only difference is one is for entertainment you already paid for and the other is for something you’ll always be paying for but believe it’s really for your own good.”
Kind of like Obamacare, huh?
If I need a photo ID to get a job and earn money that pays for welfare benefits for those who won’t work (otherwise known as “the disenfranchised”), they ought to need a photo ID to collect those benefits. If they do need one, problem solved. Who else is left that doesn’t need a photo ID these days?
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im pretty sure you dont need those to get A job (u may need them to get a legal job)….otherwise illegal immigration wouldnt be an issue
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Fastone….why is it that, you guys keep referring to voter ID as an attempt to keep people from voting ( particularly… voters likely to vote for Democrats ….the way you phrase it )…..when all this voter ID is for…..is to keep it legal and legitimate? This is NOT to keep ANY LEGITIMATE, REGISTERED voter from doing his or her patriotic duty and vote the way they feel? ANYONE that is LEGAL to vote, and that do not have a photo ID ……can get a photo ID! Let’s just keep the elections clean….so there are no disputes after the elections! This is certainly NOT too difficult to understand! ALL elections are important….from local all the way to the Presidential elections…..ANYONE that is legal to vote….and ARE WHO THEY SAY THEY ARE…..should be able to vote…..and hopefully, they will vote! People who are NOT REGISTERED in their home district, should NOT be waiting to register the day of the vote…..if they are serious about voting how they feel…..and not just coerced into voting by some group advocating a particular cause or endorsing a particular candidate! COMMON SENSE is all that is asked of here!
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from the article : “A lot of people don’t have a photo ID. They’ll be automatically disenfranchised,”. So because they are ignorant, it is incumbent upon the rest of us to educate them, lest they be disenfranchised? Puleeze! Try telling a judge that you didn’t know it was illegal to….., or I didn’t know I had to……. It won’t get you anywhere with the judge, and it shouldn’t with the ballot. Ignorance brought us Obama and his regime of unelected, unaccountable, socialist czars. It brought us the most damaging blow to our constitutional liberties in our history (obamacare. If the gov’t can coerce you into purchasing something via a punitive tax, what can’t they force you to do?). The only way we wright this country is to see that only those who have a right to vote get to vote. Voter ID laws all provide a means to provide ID’s free of charge to those who can’t afford them. The US supreme court has upheld those laws in states like Indiana. The only reason the Democrats continue to fight against them is because they benefit from those illegal votes. Period. So no, it’s not about preventing qualified people from voting as Levi claims, it’s about stopping the fraud. I fail to see why the naysayers are so worked up over the alleged disenfranchisement of a demographic group, a majority of whom can’t even be bothered to take the time to get to the polls and vote. Wouldn’t their efforts be better spent on a get out to vote campaign? Except that they’ve been courting the fraudulent vote for so long that they’ve come to feel entitled to it.
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Voter I.D. does not disenfranchise anyone if you provide them with a government issued I.D. card. You libs are all for government provided healthcare, housing, welfare, and everything else under the sun, but you think that providing an I.D. card to vote is a major obstacle? Come on! Maybe you should talk about how the automobile industry disenfranchises people from voting instead. The price of vehicles is so high that some people don’t have the money to buy a car and therefore drive themselves to vote. Or perhaps you should file a class action lawsuit against mother nature for preventing people from getting to the polls during natural disasters….talk about disenfranchising!
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Federal law already requires people provide proof of identity to board an airplane, get a passport, or start work at a new job. Photo ID is also required when renting a car, purchasing alcohol, cashing a check or entering a federal building. The many photo ID requirements we encounter in our daily lives are legitimate, effective security measures.
Securing the ballot box is just as important. True Americans overwhelmingly support voter-id and value the integrity of their elections and want them as fair, honest, and legal as possible.
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Considering that the ID won’t cost them anything, what you’re saying then is the people you’re so concerned about are too lazy to get off their butts and go get one.
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You get to learn a valuable life lesson today: Nobody is going to wipe your nose, tie your shoes and hold your hand all the way to the end. At some point you have to put your Big Boy panties on and do things for yourself. That might even include leaving the house, getting on a bus or going somewhere. If this is too much for the people you’re so worried about, I don’t think I want them voting. (They can hang out with you on election day since you won’t be voting either.)
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Levi – by law you are required to update your drivers license with your current address within 30 days after moving. Regardless of voter id, you would have to do it anyway
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Levi…..am not positive about this….BUT, seeing as though you move around the area…..the current address you have ( at the time of an election )…..may be incorrect on your ID……but your photo still shows what you look like…..you would probably need to still bring a current utility bill or something …….to verify your new address! BUT, THE IMPORTANT thing here is your photo…which still remains the same, irregardless of your actual street address! SO< all in all…..should be no problem for you! One other thing…..it is very important that you change the address on your ID……as soon as you move,……and NOT wait until election day.
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There have been a ton of answers, but the moderator won’t post them.
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Levi – the reason you don’t receive a ticket or citation is because you’re being dishonest with the police officer.
If/when he/she asks if that is your current address, if you don’t receive a ticket or citation it’s because you lied and said yes. If they don’t ask, it’s still a lie thru omission because as I stated ealier, it’s a state law your drivers license/state issued id is updated within 30 days after you move.
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They do, in fact, ask that question on occassion, depending on the officer. Also, ignorance of the law is no excuse.
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Securing the ballot box is just as important. True Americans overwhelmingly support voter-id and value the integrity of their elections and want them as fair, honest, and legal as possible. For those looking for definitive proof of voter fraud. Far left Democrat Jimmy Carter led a bipartisan commission on Federal Election Reform and concluded ‘The electoral system cannot inspire public confidence if no safeguards exist to deter or detect fraud or to confirm the identity of voters.’ The commission recommended stronger photo-identification requirements at the polls. See http://tinyurl.com/87sxtt5.
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Get a valid ID, then you get to vote! Simple rule. If voting is important to that individual, they will do what is required to. If not, that is their choice. That same valid ID should be required for filing for unemployment, health care, and on and on. The fact there is voter fraud in this country is most disturbing. We cant trust the system or the people that run it…. OUCH!
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I dont see where cost of a license or where you have to get it is relative to voter fraud. Theres alway going to be challenges no matter the system. I do think dropping the electoral college and going to a straight popular vote with todays technology shouldnt be that difficult. Then and only then, will YOUR vote make a difference!
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Levi….Honest question…..are you here to argue, just for the sake of it….or what you consider a legitimate debate? Hope to answer a couple of questions for you, that you asked earlier…..The post card that you have, showing your voting location, your district numbers for your congress man, your state legislators, school district …etc….just gives you the particular info about ( based on your CURRENT ADDRESS) what district races you CAN vote for….this card is NOT a verifiable document to use for ID purposes…..( no photo )….just so you know where you can vote and what district races yo CAN vote for…..DEPENDING ON IF YOUR CURRENT ADDRESS IS CORRECT! If wrong because of a change in address……it is up to you to get it changed. As far as you NOT getting ticketed when you were pulled over…..the typical police officer is not going to ticket you just because you just moved…..BUT, IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to get your address changed on all of your documents…..NOT to difficult…..comprende?
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Levi……you do not even have to bring the post card with you to vote…..just go to the correct polling place…..show your DL or your state ID…..do your thing and leave….quit trying to push everybody’s buttons here……OK? You are just trying to waste everybody’s time here……and you know it! Too much time on your hands!
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You must be, obviously pretty young…..never had civics in high school…do not have too much experience in voting procedures……or, like I mentioned already…..you are just pushing people’s buttons / jerking their chains…..whatever! I frankly, do not have any more time trying to explain to you what you have to do……how to do it…….and the reasons WHY…..over and out!
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Take 100,000,000 votes x your .004 and tell me what you see???? Elections have been won by far less margin than this….
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Etemn….. I agree, but I also believe, the % figure is higher….as there seems to be way too many QUESTIONABLE ballots that are not reported / prosecuted…..such as “finding box loads of ballots” in someone’s trunk of their car….and many other “excuses” ballot judges have mentioned! NO BALLOTS…..UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES should be leaving the facility that they have been cast in….untill WELL AFTER they have been tabulated and verified…..does not matter whether they have been counted or not…….they are not to leave until the results of the election have bee determined….putting ballots in boxes of someone’s personal vehicle…..WHAT ON EARTH is THIS SYSTEM comming to?…..this is potential fraud……just waiting to happen…..especially before they have been counted….and even afterwards, someone can alter the ballot and say….we found mistakes….hold on….may change the outcome of the election! BOTTOM LINE FOLKS…….why not prevent it…… BEFORE it happens?……all of our very futures……could ride on this! You ALL know this……in your hearts!
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ctcmn…..Sorry, I made a typo of your name!
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Obama administration opposes voter-id laws, not because they are constitutional questionable but, more than likely, because they realize they are more likely to benefit from voter fraud than be harmed by it.
There are few rights that are valued as dearly as the right to the
universal franchise. Wars have been fought to secure it and wars have been fought to protect it. People have died defending it and they have died trying to make sure it was extended to others. Spend the $20 for a valid driver license & move on…
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Could you expand on that a bit?
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The text of the question as it will appear on ballots is this: “”Shall the Minnesota Constitution be amended to require all voters to present valid photo identification to vote and to require the state to provide free identification to eligible voters, effective July 1, 2013?”
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If getting a drivers license or state-issued ID card requires a major value judgment on their part because it might take them away from home, maybe they should just stay home. Wow. Do you want your entire life handed to you so you never have to make any effort whatsoever? You’re really going to hate the real world should you ever decide to venture out into it.
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are you trying to say people want to vote just as much as they want to drink??? no i do think so…not to mention drinking underage doesnt bring you to jail and give you a felony whereas voter fraud does (perfect deterrent nothing else is needed-i.e. no voter id)
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I own property in districts 6 and 8 in Minnesota and a condo in Florida. I think I’m going to vote in both districts in MN then fly to Florida and vote down there this election. Without votor-id I’m going to register in two locations in MN, and change my primary address to Florida then I can vote for Romney in MN and FL as well as Michelle Bachmann and Chip Cravvack in MN. I’ve been way to honest my whole life, I need to start thinking and acting like you democrats … you know who you are, you are the ones that “found” a few hundred extra votes in St. Louis county in 2010 for that comedian senator that thinks rape is a joke …
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Steveo,
A voter ID itself would not prevent you from voting in both MN and FL, since you could easily get photo ID from both states. I have had valid photo IDs from more than one state before. That is easy to do. To prevent that kind of voter fraud, we would need a national voter registration database to prevent someone with two photo IDs from voting in two places. In Texas, a gun permit counts as a valid photo ID for voting (a student photo ID even from a state university does not). So I could vote there with a gun permit and here with my drivers license. Photo ID does not solve these problems.
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Steveo…..You bring up a very valid point! Yes, there probably should be a national voter base….so that a voter can vote in his / her home district….and be electronically inputed…..that registration COULD NOT possibly be registered ANYWHERE else in the country! The bad part of that….is this would be another “BIG BROTHER IS WATCHING” type of thing…..and we are trying to end that scenario…..before it goes “full scale”! BUT, votes with a photo ID…..would be a good step in the right direction! We want to stop any “irregularities” ……no “finding additional ballots”…..anything along those lines! Elections are very important……ONLY REGISTERED LEGAL VOTES should be able to vote….we all want good, clean elections…..every election…..local or national……..period!
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In my ideal world, no one would be allowed to vote unless they had a valid concealed carry permit…
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To SteveO…
As Sam pointed out, a photo ID would not prevent you from doing as you proposed and you could easily get photo ID’s to do exactly as you proposed such as having a driver license in two different states.
The reason that NOBODY can find a case where a photo ID would prevent fraud is because besides the instances of voter fraud being so extremely rare…they are almost all entirely felons who voted when their voting rights suspended which a photo ID of course wouldn’t prevent. Even the Minnesota Majority which is the Republican paid for whores to push this amendment, couldn’t find a single case that a photo ID would prevent and by their own admission only found 113 cases in Minnesota of fraudlent voting in 2010 out of 2.9 million votes cast and they were all felons. So what is the point?
If you did do what you proposed SteveO, it would mean you are knowingly committing two federal felonies with each count punishable by up to 5 years in a Federal Prison. Now please try to think about this because at the very heart of all the lies and nonsense and propaganda you’ve been fed by Faux News and all the Reichwing talking heads….the real truth is in the answer to this question….Would you really even contemplate casting 2 fraudulent votes weighed against the fact you could do 10 years in Prison for it if caught? The answer should be obvious and it also explains why voter fraud is NOT committed by people knowingly.
The dumb ruse by O’Keefe used by Repubs to show that without photo ID he could impersonate Holder…why do you think he DIDN’T actually vote? Why you think in his own video he ran out of building? Because he knew full well that if he did vote he could face a lengthy prison sentence. We already have a detterent that trumps a photo ID and why we don’t have a voter fraud problem.
Do some research and dare to think for yourself, Faux News is Lying to you, Karl Rove is lying to you, the Minnesota Majority is lying to….because none of them can prove that there is a voter fraud problem and none of them can prove a photo ID would prevent that “rampant” voter fraud the Minnesota Majority barks about in Minnesota…all 113 cases out of 2.9 million votes. Which btw where all felons who lost their right to vote and a photo ID wouldn’t have prevented.
Also, Faux has lied to you about the Coleman Franken election. Norm Coleman’s legal team after 8 months of scrutinizing the votes is on record to the state supreme court that they couldn’t find a single case of voter fraud. That hasn’t stopped Faux News from lying to you though…there’s a reason the FCC won’t give them a News license…they have an entertainment broadcast license…so they can say whatever they want, it’s entertainment, it’s not news.
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I see you went after Levi. Why no answers to my common sense points? Doesn’t fit in with rhetoric, I suppose?
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But your second comment Dan is hilarious. Big time thumbs up.
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So how do these poor disenfrachised people who you so insultingly paint as pathetic, helpless creatures unable to fend for themselves get by on a day-to-day basis?
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My grandfather gets along just fine, and he almost never uses a photo ID. I know people with jobs who don’t drive and don’t show an ID to go to work or the grocery store. This isn’t Soviet Russia. People aren’t asked for their “papers” by KGB in the grocery store. People without IDs aren’t helpless. Mostly it is just people who drive cars that really need a photo ID on a regular basis, and middle aged white people with good jobs are the least likely to lack a car. Young and old folks tend to not use cars as much, but they aren’t helpless.
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Oh. So they ARE able to get out of the house, go to work and lead productive lives? Unless it involves stopping somewhere along the way and getting a photo ID? Make up your mind.
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Read the NY Times article. Some people in rural areas live an hours drive from the DMV, and they don’t even have a car. So getting the DMV ID is a royal pain for about 50 million eligible voters. These voters have jobs and are good people, but going to the DMV by bus hours away is not a priority. Their family and jobs are the priority.
To quote the NY Times:
““In West Texas, some people [who don't own any cars] would have a 200-mile round-trip drive” to the nearest state office to get a card, he testified, according to The Dallas Morning News. More than a quarter of the state’s counties don’t even have an office to get a driver’s license or voter card. Lines at the San Antonio motor vehicles offices are often more than two hours long, he said.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/14/opinion/voter-ids-on-trial-in-texas.html?_r=2&hp
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thank you sam for pointing out what ive been trying to tell them…just because something is easy for them to do doesnt mean its easy for everyone and that different people are affected disproportionally by these laws. But thats the whole point by the voter id backers……hey how can we win elections when democrats far outnumber republicans>??? lets make it harder for certain people..(hmmm they all tend to primarily vote democrat) to vote period.
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