OUR OPINION: To Eliot Glassheim, Curt Kreun: Thanks
June 27, 2012 at 3:55 pm in Grand Forks Herald
Eliot Glassheim was elected to the North Dakota House in 1974, lost his re-election bid in 1976, was defeated again in 1978 and then turned those losses into one of the most remarkable political careers in Grand Forks history. Continue Reading
Oh yes, thanks to Glassheim for voting against a tax exemption and helping to hinder attempts to give us a choice in local healthcare.
More like no thanks, glad to be done.
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Mr. Glassheim and Mr. Kreun were part of a majority coalition on the city council which assured that citizens of Grand Forks would have less disposable income.
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Gene DuBois (if that is your real name) ….What have you ever done to ensure the citizens of Grand Forks have more disposable income? That’s what I thought. Every time I read area voices comments I see a lack of true thought on the issues and a major lack of civility. I don’t think posting my comments will change your mind, however, really dig down deep and think about what you could do to help the community instead of constantly tear people down.
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Melody Olstad (if that is your real name)…criticism of voting records is not “tearing down” anyone.
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Just make sure you are truly citing the correct voting record.
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I thank both men for their service. That said, I hope it is a record never repeated.
Public service is not a career. It is not to be professionalized. America was founded, in part, on the rejection of a professional ruling class: an aristocracy.
30 years in office, IN ANY OFFICE, is not public service; it is a dynasty.
I was taken to task on another thread for these thoughts. The argument was that since we know these people personally, they do not amass the same power &/or patronage a national politician would.
I think that is naive & wrong. The only difference between a $10,000 city contract & a $10 billion defense program is the number of zeros.
Both rely on government officials to get implemented so they are both open to the same type of abuse
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Glassheim habitually won relection for both the council and legislature from his district. His one attempt at a city-wide election pretty much showed that his popularity was severely limited.
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Perfect…now if you are dissatisfied you should learn the whole issue and take it on yourself. Not exactly sure what issue you are talking about. Maybe you should go out and find funding for a water treatment plant.
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Yes, Melody Olstad is my real name and I am not ashamed to post comments using it. Flying nurse, neither of these men made politics a career because that would imply making a living from doing so. And yes, I do happen to know Curt Kreun personally and I do know the hours spent working for the city. Maybe those being so negative about an article of thanks should try this out for themselves and see how many thankless hours are spent working on behalf of others. Geesh!
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Melody,
As I have made clear, I am not questioning their motivation. I am questioning a system that allows one person such a long time in office. That is simply unhealthy for the community (even in ND where we are pathologically adverse to change).
Your point about making a living doing it is well taken but misinformed. For the first 150 years the only people in this country who ran for office were the wealthy. They were the only ones who could afford to be away from home that long.
Congressional pay is still a pittance of what a smart person can earn on the outside, and elections are so expensive, that it is once again a rich person’s game. That is not how it should be.
I believe in term limits. A citizenry needs a responsive electorate and the longer they are in place the less responsive they become. Given inertia, they do not have to be.
When you can remember the times an incumbent lost off the top of your head (Berg vs Pomeroy, etc) there is something desperately wrong with the system.
I was also against Mayor Brown running for the same reasons. I know Mayor Brown; I used to work with him. He is a good man. I just wish he knew when it was time to go.
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Why do you think Curt didn’t run again? This isn’t his life. He was going to quit the last term but was highly encouraged to run and he ran unopposed. He would’ve more than likely ran unopposed this time as both candidates for Ward 7 talked to him first to see if he was running…and they wouldn’t have run if he had decided to. And there ARE term limits…they are determined by the voters, so if you don’t agree with someone being mayor, councilman, or any elected position, you should work to change that…go out and support someone by going door to door for them. Gather strong, factual information and present it to voters. That will help with the term limits.
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And how long do you think Curt was actually on the council? He wasn’t there for 30, 20, or even 15 years. It was actually 12.
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And again I ask Gene DuBois…where is your voting record? Can I access it online? To which group were you elected? And what votes are you talking about that constitute Grand Forks residents losing disposable income? If you are challenging a voting record, please be specific.
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Next time you eat at a restaurant or buy a bottle of wine, check out the bill. Notice the extra sales tax? Know where it goes? Know who approved it? Also, while you’re at it, check out the amount of property in GF with tax abatements. Guess who makes up that lost revenue. Guess who approved those too.
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What percentage of the property has tax abatements?
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What sales tax was raised in a restaurant?
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The hospitality industry got hit with an extra sales tax to support the Great White Elephant that sits empty most of the time. You know the place; your father was the city council representative on its board.
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The hospitality tax was not raised while he was on the council. That was apart of the original vote and process when the “White Elephant” as you call it was put into play. Try to schedule an event at the “White Elephant” right now. You will be out at least a year. I don’t think it sits empty, but thanks for your uninformed perspective. Did you read the minutes of the Alerus Commission? There is a 400 thousand operating profit to date for 2012.
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The figures issued by the Alerus always look great. Then an outside auditor does the books and the excrement hits the ventilator. But that’s ok, those resonsible get rewarded by being hired by the city to continue the same process.
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Go examine the last audited figures for 2011 by an outside auditor. $400 thousand is year to date and it can change. Do the homework.
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Take the history of the last 10 operating years of the old Grand Forks Civic Center and compare it to the last 10 years of the Alerus. I think you’ll be surprised by the losses of the Civic Center in comparison. And then compare the economic impact of the Alerus Center to the Center Center. The same economic indicators can be used to show the economic impact of the University of North Dakota on the Greater Grand Forks Community.
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Melody: You’ve engaged a couple of areavoice pros today. I’ve always appreciated people willing to step up and run for local office, but it’s hard to just say thanks anymore without a fight. It’s like hecklers at a college graduation ceremony. But, to embrace free speech we must tolerate bad form. There’s plenty of it here every day. By the way, I think the GF voters overwhelmingly passed a couple of sales tax issues. Just sayin’
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WOW!! This is a thank-you column…these people are being thanked for their commitment to the city and the work they put in. Just because you don’t agree with them doesn’t mean they didn’t work hard and do what they thought was best for the city. You are a day late and a dollar short Gene DuBois. You should’ve called Curt Kreun with your concerns when he was still on the council. He spent hours on the phone talking to constituents and valued their opinions, but he never heard from you. I wonder why? Maybe you just like to complain about things. That’s being a part of the problem rather than the solution.
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I challenge all posters to use their real names. Allowing people to use an alias allows people who pretend to know the issues a chance to do more than vent. They spew hatred and spread misinformation. And don’t tell me you are afraid of repercussions for using your real name….I don’t buy it. The way the majority of the posters on this site rip into people is beyond questioning a record.
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I’m afraid of repercussions for using my real name. I speak my mind and some people don’t like that.
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tj, as you see, I speak my mind as well. If I speak my mind, but don’t resort to crude comments, being needlessly rude, mudslinging and the like, there’s less of a chance for repercussions. With that said, no matter what you do in this life, there are some consequences, but often, if you are honest, they are worth it in the long run. This however, was a thank-you column. Glassheim and Kreun are done on the council. What does it further by running their names through the mud at this point?
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Maybe to remind someone that some people out there are actually grateful that their time on the council is over? I am.
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“nevertru” …Again, I ask what you did to help change the things you thought were wrong (besides blog here) in Grand Forks? I don’t have respect for your opinions if you can’t even use your real name. If you used your real name, then I would at least be able to agree to disagree with you. At least Mr. DuBois was using his real name. At least it appears as such.
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Kurt’s your dad so I understand your emotions.
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Correction….Curt’s your dad so I understand your emotions.
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I guess that explains how criticizing a voting record becomes dragging people through the mud.
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Guess you should’ve googled me sooner – haha! Seriously, though, you act like Kreun and Glassheim had the same voting record. And just to be clear, I think it’s too late to criticize either one of these people since they are done on the council. I stand by my statement earlier that you should’ve called or gotten involved when you seem to so passionately disagree with a vote. Just sayin’ (as they say). But I do give you kudos for using your real name.
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Melody, the problem with your argument is that anyone can use any name on here. If they’re desperate enough, they can look someone’s name up in the phone book and use it on here. Who knows who’s is real or not?
If you can’t respect an opinion of mine because of my username, you’re basically saying you can’t respect anyone’s opinion on here.
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Not to beat a dead horse, but you just made my point exactly. “Never” were “tru”er words spoken. I don’t have as much respect for the sentiments that you shared here as I would if you and I had a conversation in person. That being said, you really don’t either. Instead of trying to find a problem with my argument, you should be trying to understand my argument. It isn’t that everyone on these boards with an alias should go and change it to their real name. It’s that standing up for your beliefs by attaching your name to it gives it more credibility.
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Thanks for your comments Alvin. I believe in free speech. Just stand behind your words with your real name. Choose your words wisely. That’s called character.
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Finally someone who knows how to google! And, yes tj, Curt is my dad, however, I have commented on many things that have nothing to do with him. My opinions have nothing to do with emotion. They are only that…opinions. I still stand by using your true name. I think it makes one more credible, but I can see that many disagree with me in this forum. I guess that’s why those people comment here; because they can hide behind anonymity.
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Believe it or not, Ms. Olstad, I brought that up some time ago here. The consensus was that people were afraid of retribution. Not a happy commentary about the character of the people of Grand Forks.
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And to what kind of retribution were they referring? The only time people will suffer retribution is if they pass false information as being true or slander someone. What does that say about the people’s character that are commenting? Truly, I don’t care if someone doesn’t like Curt Kreun, but let’s be clear. You are lumping Glassheim and Kreun together and believe me…they do not have the same voting record. Check it out.
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The retribution in question is physical violence perpetrated on them or their family, due to a difference in opinion. As for your father, I neither like nor dislike him; I don’t know him. I dislike his propensity for spending taxpayer money on projects to satisfy the whims of a few, when the private sector wouldn’t come in. Projects he would have never invested his own capital into because he knew they would produce no return for him. One of the great fallacies is that if you elect businessmen to office, they will actually follow business practices. Never been that way on the GF city council.
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I’m sorry but that was my point. I have been on the ACSC threads since the beginning of the lockout. Some people really don’t like me for my views. TJ is my first name though but the last is private.
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If you treat government entirely like business, it won’t be accepted by the people. Because in business in the private sector, it quite often requires making steadfast, harsh decisions. People do not accept harsh and steadfast decisions by their government. They don’t want it to affect them. You can’t just arbitrarily make the same decisions that you make in business.
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I have never had any retribution for my opinions and my dad has never had any physical retributions for his opinions. He has, however, had financial retributions for his opinions on the council. That is the price you pay for being a public servant. Oh, and of course, anonymous complaints by the uninformed.
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Because of my position the boss frowns on people associated with the organization voicing opinions that could be construed as representing the organization. For that reason all social media is monitored. We are free to comment, just not mention where we work.
That does not stop me from arguing with my bosses boss here online. Hasn’t fired me yet, but I don’t get a Christmas card either
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Good for you…and just for the record, I did “like” your post! I still think you should be able to use your own name, just not talk about your company. It’s a shame that you can’t debate your boss’s boss under your own name. You would probably win the debate:)
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A few years back (2004 or 2005) there was a march in favor of a gay marriage amendment on the ballot. I marched to show support for a few of my friends who were heavily involved. I had absolutely nothing on that could identify my place of employment (jeans and a UND only — no logo — hoodie). Whose mug ends up on the news? You got it.
The next day I have to go see the boss. Even though I was there as a UND student and had nothing to identify myself with the company, I got the evil eye.
In a small town people know who you are.
Blessing and a curse
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Well, Melody, most people agree with you, including me. Yeh, while I hide behind a made-up name. There has to be some comfort in knowing that only about 4 people are reading these posts. Still, we’ve gotten less nice, partly because of the anonymity, but people just aren’t that nice. Many council decisions might be 60/40. If you are around long enough, everyone is going to have a problem with your “voting record” as Gene calls it. I actually don’t know Curt and Elliot that well, but I have a hunch they handled controversy with more poise than 99% of us. It’s getting harder and harder to find people for a golf club board, much less finding good people to run for council. We can all take part of the blame for this.
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Alvin, I know that only a few of us read these, but I just think we could all be doing more for our community. And you are correct, who would want to run for anything unless you have really thick skin. I would truly hope that no one would suffer any kind of retribution for their opinions beyond people disliking the comments.
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The purpose of these boards is social interaction and to some degree activism. They are the town square of the 21 century.
This last election showed that both sides monitored the boards. During the FS debacle leading up to the election Haga did a couple of stories quoting the boards.
They are not tidy. People do say things they would not say in person, but they are useful.
I completely disagreed with the Fargo paper’s decision to do away with them. I hope the new boss at the Harald (happy Gene) does not follow suit here, although there are signs she intends to.
Discourse over emotional issues is rarely pretty. That does not mean it is not needed.
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I agree these boards are useful, but you still haven’t convinced me that a real name shouldn’t be required. The old “townsquare” as you call it required people to show up, face to face. You are right, they are not tidy, and they can be a valuable tool, but we as a society need to stand up for certain rights and we give those rights more credibility by attaching our names to it. I think it’s our responsibility.
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FlyingNurse, while don’t believe this is true for you, I believe that some people don’t want to attach their names to their opinions because they are afraid of being “called on the carpet” when they are wrong about something. This is sometimes a lazy person’s way of airing their opinions. It’s too easy to not back up your opinion with the facts. If you are proved wrong on a subject, suck it up and admit to it. It just shows you’re a bigger person.
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I agree completely with this sentiment. I have had to eat crow more than once. It is simply the nature of political discourse.
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Jack at the Forum habitually gave a leafy spurge to whoever disagreed with him. Guess he got tired of those on the Forum blog who couldn’t understand he was the vox dei. I give commentary here til December until the Empress Theodora eliminates it.
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I think you are right Gene. They are trolling the boards right now. Not fairly though…as we have said before. I wouldn’t mind if it was fair but it isn’t. We might just have to take over Port’s site someday just to shake him up a little.
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I appreciate the fact Port posts stories the Herald never will. I don’t care all that much for the tone of many posters. He pretty much allows everything there. Not to mention those who have their own blogs there. But my bet is if Mary Tudor shuts this blog down, the number of hits on the site will drop enormously.
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The DNT (Duluth) gets over 4 million hits a month. I would be curious to know how the Herald compares to that. The DNT has a header every once in a while that tells the previous months number.
I agree with you on Ports’s site. The tone is not friendly. I don’t want to see the F word either. To me swearing is a clear sign of immaturity.
But if they break us up….it was nice knowing you Gene. I will mail you back the ring or can I keep it?
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The place is still up, so no need for precipitous goodbyes at this point. By all means, keep the ring, and the other paraphenalia.
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TJ, the GFH.com reached Pageviews: 4,105,557 in the past 30 days
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Thank you Joe for that information. It’s nice to see we have numbers that rival Duluth’s.
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I have to sign out for the night, but thanks everyone…it was fun! Too bad we couldn’t have all sat together at a restaurant and had a cup of coffee and debated. We could have done more for the economy that way!
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Nice to meet you, Melody.
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Yes I agree with Gene. It was a good conversation.
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To the three people who clicked “Dislike” on Melodies comment– Huh? I don’t understand how anyone could have had negative vibes about a totally innocuous statement like hers.
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I leave the room for a couple of hours and the debate turns into a love fest. When the Herald had the old comment line, it was outrageous and worse than pathetic. What makes these boards less so is the fact that we can quickly respond to the most unfair comments. I was completely in agreement with Melody about the anonymous thing when it was in print. Now, if the Herald keeps a close eye and monitors the most ridiculous, ugly, unfair comments, I’m hoping it will stay for a while. I absolutely see Melody’s point, but I would miss this nonsense. Who wouldn’t miss alwaysawreck and his comments with more than 100 dislikes?
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Curt and his wife did a good job raising their daughter.
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Thanks tj. I enjoy debate…I just like to know who I am debating. But after all these posts, I do feel like I know you all a little bit:) But I still haven’t changed my position (no matter how many dislikes I get).
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Alvin, I see where you are coming from….responding immediately is a part of the usefulness of these boards.
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