Altru head: Expansion delayed 2 years
April 19, 2012 at 1:25 am in Grand Forks Herald
Altru Health System is pushing back the expansion of its main campus in Grand Forks by two years and selling land it bought for a south end clinic, according to President Casey Ryan on Wednesday. Continue Reading
“This way the community would be in control of it and not an outside interest.”
correction…
“This way Altru will continue to be the only healthcare option in GF.”
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What is it about Altru that no one I know has a neutral opinion on them?
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Ya….Just how does the community have more control? Sounds like anal extraction to me?
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When will Altru invest in their employees?
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MONOPOLY!
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The community was relieved that they bought it? Come on??? They wanted no competition and now they have it. I wasn’t going to Fargo before but I will be now. I won’t fund the monopoly that is here if I can help it. And the idea that competition will increase costs is total bunk. Isn’t capitalism meant to lower costs?
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You seem to know something about fianances here….Can you explain how these big health care facillities are allowed the tax exempt status of “Non Profit” When they’re anything but non profit? I can understand how hospitals got that status back when major religions ran the hospitals, but not now….
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Sorry, can’t explain that. Like all non-profits, the people that work there can certainly make a profit (be paid well). The doctor, presidents, board members, etc. can make good money. Probably not “much” more than at for-profit businesses or they might run afoul of the laws, but that still lets them make millions.
At the end of the year, they need to “donate” any earnings somewhere. Look at how much Sanford Hospital money gets thrown around (which is different than the money that Sanford himself donates). I don’t know how/why they aren’t limited further in what they charge. I’d think it would be better to have cheaper healthcare, even if that means Sanford Hospitals can’t donate $10M to NDSU for a new sports arena or ?? to someone else.
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Another post mentioned it had to do with them having to treat everyone regardless if they had insurance or not….That at least explains the why….I’d still like to know if they have to prove how much of a loss they absorbe every year or if this is basically just a given? Because I know from what I’ve heard that they’re pretty agressive when it comes to collection regardless if someone has insurance or not…..So I’m not sure how much they lose in a year that they don’t eventually get back……Any other business loses money like that and they don’t get an automatic total exemption on all taxes….Just on the loss….
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The community was “relieved”? ARE YOU CRAZY? Most people I know are so angry that if weren’t going to Altru NOW, they are certainly NOT going there in the future. THere may as well be a third lane on I-29 heading south, because more and more people will be going to Fargo!!! Altru was afraid of the competition. Period. They have proven this over and over. They have intimidated all of us into believing that if they aren’t “sole providers,” they can no longer continue to offer us the services we are used to. Well, don’t you get it, Altru!?? THAT’S THE WHOLE IDEA! We don’t WANT your crappy service anymore. Many of us were looking for a CHOICE! But you made sure in a dirty, underhanded way that didn’t happen. I wonder what the FTC will say about this little “buy out”? I wonder if Altru received all of the proper “okays” from government agencies like Medicare and Medicaid before they decided to steal this deal away from Doctors’ Hospital — they day before they were to open, no less. How does a non-profit come up with so much money all of a sudden??? Is there a good-ol-boy’s club that is alive and well (rhetorical question)?? Let’s see, an employee of Altru is also the MAYOR of the Grand Forks. Gee, I wonder how objective he is when it comes to anything having to do with healthcare competition in this city — it would take money out his pockets too, wouldn’t it? This whole thing is and was a dirty little ruse Altru pulled on the people of GF… but this is going to cost you, Altru… it’s going cost you in ways you never imagined, mostly what little reputation and integrity you had left in this community. If your monopoly and house of cards begins to fall, it will be your own corporate greed and huge egos that caused it.
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If you were responding to Terry…You didn’t read far enough….She’s saying the same thing as you….Just shorter…
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I think it is really messed up what Altru is doing. They are opening the exact same clinics that are already out at Aurora. A PT clinc, Dialysis. And then they gave lab and imaging the boot and are now opening those out here. Way to try intimidate the people that have places out there. Heaven for bit there be another medical facility in this town for people to have more than just one option. As a member of the Grand Forks community this infuriates me. What a joke. They should be ashamed.
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Oh ya, and not to mention the fact that they kicked out the surgery center and lookie lookie they are opening a same day surgery. Now all they need to open a OBGYN clinic since they have to leave as well. Then there is also the sleep lab that has to leave and shocker they are opening one of those as well. Does anyone else see a pattern here?
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I am confused at the animosity toward Altru. My understanding is that the south end medical park started because there was going to be an Aurora hospital and independent doctors that would have their clinics there. Then the Aurora hospital failed to open, the people who funded the hospital and medical park put it up for sale. Many looked at the buildings, including Sanford and Altru. Altru bought the buildings and now Altru wants to use the buildings for their services so they are not renewing any leases and are allowing those that want to end their leases early that option. If Sanford (or any other medical facility) had purchased the buildings they would have also wanted to put their own services in place – they would have given the current tenants “the boot” when the leases were up too.
If I bought a house that I want to live in and there is a renter currently living in the house I just bought – I would give the renter the notice that I would not be renewing the lease once the lease was up. Am I missing something? Doesn’t this make sense?
Seems like people should be upset at those that sold the buildings to Altru, not at Altru for buying the buildings.
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I completely agree with Hiliary. You can’t buy something that isn’t for sale. Unfortunately, businesses run a risk with leasing a building-the owners can sell at any time. Those clinics are welcome to find a new location anywhere in town and re-open. Altru didn’t buy the clinics-they bought the buildings.
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Ya, I get that Altru bought the buildings. But seriously, you have to put the same facilities, to whom have many years left on their leases, that are already in the building. That is bs and they should feel bad about what they are doing. They are basically pushing for the people who are left to get out. The are going to run people out of business because of their own greed. And yes you are missing something….the big picture. It is wrong what they are doing and if don’t get that then you need to rethink your morals.
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Mandi, I have no skin in this game – I am neither pro Altru nor anti Altru. But I do not think I am immoral just because I don’t agree with you. Just like I would never say you are stupid for not agreeing with me.
One thing that doesn’t make sense to me: You are mad because Altru bought Doctors Hospital and forced the competition out because competition is good and people deserve a choice. But you are also mad because Altru is planning on starting businesses (such as PT, dialysis) that are the same or similar to businesses that are already out there……but isn’t that giving people a choice and directly competing? Isn’t that what many on these posts are clamoring for?
I think you may have been directly affected by the purchase of the buildings and so there is some emotion for you that I just don’t have. But that emotion may be clouding your judgement of the facts (or the facts that have been published anyway.) We just have different perspectives.
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Hillary, stop bending facts in an attempt to make Altru look better. You’re only making yourself look worse.
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Hillary,
I do know a lot of facts and if you don’t then you probably shouldn’t be commenting on here. Yes, I do believe in the competion but does that mean we should go open the same businesses that Altru has in their hospital/clinic. I think your morals are messed up because a lot of people are affected by this and you are not understanding the peoples feeling you are only listening to what Altru is putting in the papers and a lot of it is not the cold hard facts. I never said anything about Doctors Hospital at all. I am talking about the small hard working business orders who are being forced to make life changing/altering decision that mean they could lose what they have worked for their whole lives on. Learn the facts first.
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I get that healthcare is a very personal & emotional thing for a lot of people, but unfortunately there has to be a business side to it as well. From the sounds of the article, Altru had planned to build a brand new clinic in the area anyway-probably offering those same services. Financially, I’m guessing it made more sense for them to buy an existing building-that was for sale-that is already set up for the intended type of business-healthcare. I personally don’t think Aurora or Doctor’s Hospital would’ve posed much of a threat to Altru from a competition standpoint, so I guess I don’t agree with that angle. Options are nice though. There are some Altru doctors I don’t care for, so if I don’t like the one I’m seeing, I will choose a different one the next time. It doesn’t necessarily make me want to go to an entirely different healthcare facility.
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ha ha nevertru bending the facts? more like laying down the truth, you just don’t like it. Everyone has an opinion, your just mad that everyone doesn’t agree with you, like me, i love altru!
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hillary, thank you for your objective, rational, and mature response. this seems to be an emotional topic for so many, and i do not know the history behind their “hatred” of altru so won’t comment on that. i for one do appreciate your posts though as you seem to have an unbiased understanding of the situation and the facts, which i believe so many who post here do not.
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Huh? So non-biased posts are those that actively support buying out competition to better yourself at the expense of a community?
I smell a ring of Altru employees suddenly.
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Unbiased….a find that insulting. The reason we are traveling to the Twin Cities every three months for cancer treatment is because of Altru. They had the chance to properly treat my husbands illness and they blew it. Five years ago he had a PSA test done at the heathcare facility Hilary speaks so highly of. The physician failed to inform my husband that his results needed further attention. Years went by before he realized he had a problem. You see Altru never told him he had prostate cancer. A year ago he had his prostate removed at a hospital in the Twin Cities. The doctor’s in charge of his care told him he should have had the surgery five years ago. He was cancer free for nine months but his last test showed signs that the cancer is back. Now we need to go back to the Twin Cities for six weeks of radiation treatments. Unbiased? Really? Wait until it’s someone you love.
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In response to TJ: “Altru” misdiagnosed your husband’s illness or “A doctor at Altru” did? Again this seems to be an emotional response. I am sure there are doctors at Altru that have bad reputations, maybe one or more that are just plain bad. I believe this is true at Sanford, or Kaiser Permanante or even Mayo. I am very sorry for what happened to your husband, but his story would make me not want to see that doctor, not necessarily decide that Altru is a horrible organization.
It’s not that I am speaking so highly of Altru as you commented. I just am trying to see the facts without all the obvious emotion. But I understand why you feel strongly. I just happen to think a lot of the anger is placed on the whole organization when people are angry about specific people who work there.
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Hillary, perhaps there’s emotion here because stories like TJ’s have happened WAY TOO MANY times? But still it’s “Bow to Altru, because they rule our city.”
Give me a break.
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An Altru employee will never admit their employer made a serious mistake. I’m sure it is part of your training. And please…I can read people well…don’t offer me your textbook sympathy. I hate phoniness.
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I am sorry you feel like I am phony just because I don’t agree with you. I am not an employee of Altru. None of my family members are employees. I do have 2 family members that work in Fargo at Sanford.
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So along that logic if someone shoots somebody dead then the gun shop owner should be considered guilty of selling the gun because it couldn’t have been used had it not been sold? I agree the landlord was an extreme punk in the situation, but it was Sltru who was the real assbag here…
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You have to get your facts straight. Altru is moving those areas of specialty out to the building they purchased. They are not opening anything new and are relocating current operations so the new hospital construction can begin. They are not moving the same specialties out there to scare the businesses that are currently there. They are moving those areas there because they do not need as high of care
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There’s lots of land around for Sanford to buy and Build new…They have grown and are big enough to come into GF and Build from scratch…I hope they don’t wait too long…They could probably build and be up and running in 2-3 years.
GF area has grown and will continue to do so…we NEED more options for Health Care close to home. It would make all health care better if there is competition. Until then our family will continue to use Altru only when necessary (no offence to nurses & aids… but they are always working short handed) otherwise we will continue to go to Fargo, Mpls. and Mayo for our care. We really like the Sanford Drs. in EGF and Fargo. And Drs. at Valley Bone & Joint in GF.
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Buy land?? Please tell me what land is still available that has not been purchased either by Altru — which means, of course, those land parcels are taken off the city tax rolls because they are “tax exempt.” Let’s see… starting with the building across the street from Ray Richards Golf Course and the corner of DeMers, Altru owns DeMers all the way down to Parkwood Place, then turning toward ALtru, they own all the land to almost 17th Ave S….now get on South Washington, and Altru bought ALL OF THE LAND SURROUNDING AURORA ON BOTH SIDES OF SOUTH WASHINGTON… from 40th to almost to the last stoplight out that way… that’s a lot of land that is now tax-free. I wonder who will have to pick up the “slack” of that non-profit status? Would it be the taxpaying citizens of Grand Forks????? Hmmm… and isn’t it coincidence that those are the land parcels Altru purposely chose to buy… I wonder why…would it be to cut-off in any and every way ANY competition near them?????
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Sadly, Altru doesn’t care about what we have to say, much less about the community as a whole. All they care about is bettering themselves. The fact that the Herald publishes an article like this which includes unsourced negative content regarding Aurora and Doctors shows the Herald’s biasedness toward Altru. It’s terrible that we have so many in a community that care more about one healthcare provider than about actually making the community better. This is also completely contradictory to the goals on the website for enhancing North Dakota in the future – part of the goal is supplying better health care in our communities. Read up, Altru. You’re going against the state.
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From past experience having to use Altru hospital & ER with Drs. from the area that are not Altru Drs….there have been unnecessary problems from this issue. Altru appears to not be friendly or as accommodating as they could be with outside Drs. BUT no one at Altru or the outside Drs will discuss this issue with patients. So this situation becomes known at a time when a patient has little energy to deal with it at the time. This is the main factor why we have made other choices for our family for health care outside of GF except in emergency situations. Then we’re trapped.
This has nothing to do with nursing care or others doing testing in support of all.
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We have driven to Fargo a few times for same day surgery. Prompted by problems we had at Altru with infections etc. Worked out great for Us. We also had some good experiences at Altru, but if you were having your car worked on, and they made it worse 1 times out of 4, would you go back? You can by a car but ….Vote with your checkbook.
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DeAnn, really? You’re not truly saying that Altru is increasing choices by buying out the competition, are you?
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Ya they bought the buildings and left others with no other options but to leave and are now putting clinics in the building that are already here. That doesn’t seem shady to you? And I claim bologna on the Altru had no idea that that employees/clinics were asked to leave. Then who did it? Previous owners? It doesn’t make sense to me. There are quite a few people in the community that are very disappointed in all of the decisions that have been made regarding Aurora and Altru. People come up to me everyday stating that they will no longer be receiving treatment in Grand Forks due to poor care they have received. Many are driving the distance to Fargo. How is this suppose to help with increasing hospitals/communities revneue when people are leaving Grand Forks to get care elsewhere? It’s a hard subject for a lot of people, most of us just wished there was a second hospital/medical park where we could make the decision on our own on what faiclity we choose to go too.
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This is exactly what doesn’t make sense to me. You want a second hospital/medical park so that you can have a choice. This second hospital/medical park would presumably offer the same services as Altru and compete directly with Altru. BUT you are angry that Altru is planning on providing the same services that are already provided at Aurora….competing directly and offering another choice. I don’t think you can have it both ways.
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DeAnn, quit dodging the bullet. Altru is deliberately monopolizing the city. At this point, Grand Forks would be better if another system would replace Altru. It has proven that it is the city’s enemy.
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The enemy? How many enemies give millions of dollars back to the communities they serve each year? Here are a few more facts: in 2011, Altru gave $21.6 million in charity care. Within that, there was more than $500,000 worth of medication provided through its Prescription Assistance Program. On any given day, Altru has 400 students from area schools in a variety of training programs in its facilities. There are more than 300 volunteers that provide numerous services to patients and families. Altru houses and hosts the area Meals on Wheels program. I could go on and on.
By now you’ve probably guessed it. I work at Altru. And I’m proud to work here, and I’m sure I’m not alone.
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DeAnn, you say you’re proud to work at Altru. That’s because you feel like it gives you power.
Exactly what Altru craves, and no more than that.
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They bought a building that was for sale. They own the building and are going to use it for providing their own healthcare services to better their buisness. What’s so wrong with this? I thought this was a conservative board so why aren’t you supporting private sector expansion without government intervention?
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What’s wrong with it is that they deliberately took out the competition in order to do it. The lazy way. If you’re so good at what you do, play fair and compete rather than just take them out so you can only be as good as you want to be, or, in Altru’s case, not good.
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They must have studied the history of Northworst Arlines.
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I wouldn’t be surprised that if another clinic tried to open up, the city council would pass an ordinance prohibiting them from engaging in business 500 feet from whatever they were within 500 feet of.
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Maybe it’s not quite that bad, but it’s bad enough that we have a mayor who works for Altru. Can you spell “conflict of interest”?
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True. Even if he recuses himself on Altru issues, his mere presence serves as an influence.
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In other words, vote Grandstand.
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So who then is qualified to be mayor? Apparently they must have not financial interest or ties to the community. Seems like that might not be the best choice.
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Given the mayor wields next to no power, just about anyone. But, he should do more than cede everything to the president of the city council as Brown has. The mayor does have the symbolic leverage of being elected by the whole city, not just a ward. Problem is, I’m not sure Grandstrand would stand up to him either.
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So you are concerned that a mayor who has “next to no power” might have a “conflict of interest”? I’m just trying to follow the logic.
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I don’t believe I brought up conflict of interest.
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But to attempt to answer your question, the mayor does have the power to influence and sway votes by his very presence. Thus any question about Altru has to take into account the Brown’s presence. Same as if Grandstrand were mayor, and the council had to address a question about UND, where he is a law student.
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When your responded “True” to nevertru’s “Conflict of Interest?”, I assume you were agreeing with him. Sorry if I misread your comments.
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I think what is irritating most people is the fact that in February, Altru stated that they would honor all of the leases. Now, all of these leases are being voided so Altru can open up the same services.
I for one think is funny that in February when they announced this purchase, it was because they needed the space and really needed to expand. Now the development of their campus is being delayed.
Other questions to ask yourself are what happened to all of the employees that Doctors Hospital had hired. They were in fact set to open right when Altru made the announcement? One has to wonder if Altru hired these people? Or how many of the Doctors Hospital employees left Altru to work at the new hospital? How many of them still have a job.
Still, one last point to ponder is about Sanford Health. All one has to do is look across the River in EGF to see their facilities over there. Seriously, drive around, there are three buildings that have the Sanford name on that I have counted. Plus, left over from their Merti-care days is a large chunk of undeveloped land that they are not interested in selling. Part of me thinks that it is only a matter of time before Sanford does build here, but when they do it will be on the East side. Just saying.
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What lease has been “voided”? No where in the article or comments have I seen a reference to any lease being “voided”.
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Bobby, Altru has honored all leases. No leases were broken. You may not realize that there were several month-to-month leases along with some longer term one. When a lease was due to be renewed, Altru did exercise their totally legal option not to renew, and why should they do anything else, since the reason they bought these buildings was their need for space. Some leases where terminated early by the businesses renting space, but none were terminated early by Altru.
Regarding employees, Altru was not responsible for them losing their jobs! Altru did not buy the businesses, they bought the buildings. They did not release the employees from their positions, that was done by the businesses who chose not to open after hiring all of these people.
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I think what you mean is some people are irritated because when they heard that Altru will be honoring leases they thought that meant Altru would be renewing the leases. When honoring leases means that if your lease is 6 months long you can stay for 6 months, if it is month to month lease you can stay for a month. But ultimately when the lease is up both parties have to agree to continue.
As far as the delay in expansion….I took it to mean since they bought space on the south side there wasn’t the urgency (or probably the funds) to build/expand at the main medical campus.
I hope that those employees of DH were able to be employed by Altru if they wanted.
Can’t comment on Sanford EGF … I haven’t been there
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Good Idea…Lets hope Sanford expands in EGF…also Edgewood Management has land there too. Maybe EGF could end up having a Hospital and a Nursing Home. EGF hasn’t been too business friendly though.
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Campus means field. Doesn’t necessarily mean a college.
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Maybe in Latin…but the connotation in English is university.
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Who says?
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Another of your brilliant rejoinders.
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Even HS refer to themselves as campuses as well as corporate campuses.
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BTW, “doctor” means “teacher” so I guess they can call themselves a “campus” by your definition.
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“Doctor” comes from the Latin root “docto,” “learned”. The Latin word for teacher is “magister.” I’m not going to get into a duel on linguistics with you, because you’re an unarmed man.
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Where is your def.
c.1300, “Church father,” from O.Fr. doctour, from M.L. doctor “religious teacher, adviser, scholar,” in classical L. “teacher,” agent noun from docere “to show, teach, cause to know,” originally “make to appear right,” causative of decere “be seemly, fitting” (see decent). Meaning “holder of highest degree in university” is first found late 14c.; as is that of “medical professional” (replacing native leech (2)), though this was not common till late 16c. The transitional stage is exemplified in Chaucer’s Doctor of phesike (Latin physica came to be used extensively in M.L. for medicina). Similar usage of the equivalent of doctor is colloquial in most European languages: cf. It. dottore, Fr. docteur, Ger. doktor, Lith. daktaras, though these are typically not the main word in those languages for a medical healer. For similar evolution, cf. Skt. vaidya- “medical doctor,” lit. “one versed in science.” Ger. Arzt, Du. arts are from L.L. archiater, from Gk. arkhiatros “chief healer,” hence “court physician.” Fr. médecien is a back formation from médicine, replacing O.Fr. miege, from L. medicus.
doctor (v.) Look up doctor at Dictionary.com
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You like your word games….Well when it comes to crap there’s many different ways to say the same thing…but in the end…they all stink just the same…..Just like these little side steps from the issues
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Altru Health System Named a Best Regional Hospital
Grand Forks, ND – Altru Health System is among the nation’s Best Regional Hospitals 2011-2012, according to U.S. News & World Report, publisher of Best Hospitals. U.S. News annually publishes the Best Hospitals rankings. In January 2012, its editors recognized 247 hospitals outside major metropolitan areas, including Altru, as Best Regional Hospitals.
“With three regional clinics in northeast North Dakota, seven in northwest Minnesota, and our main campus in Grand Forks, we are committed to taking care of the people in our region,” said Dave Molmen, Chief Executive Officer of Altru Health System. “We’re very happy to receive this designation and will continue to provide the best possible care to our patients.”
U.S. News annually evaluates nearly 5,000 hospitals in 16 different medical specialties. Hard numbers stand behind its analysis in most specialties – death rates, patient safety, procedure volume, and other objective data. Physicians’ responses to a national survey, in which specialists are asked to name hospitals they consider best in their specialty for the toughest cases, are factored in.
About Altru Health System
Altru Health System is a community-owned, integrated system with an acute care hospital, a rehabilitation hospital, more than a dozen clinics in Grand Forks and the region, a large home care network, and a congregate living facility. It employs nearly 200 physicians and 3,600 staff and has an annual net operating revenue of more than $400 million.
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With your ability to quote press releases you should work for the herald.
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Is the art. accurate or not?
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As with all USNWR rankings, it’s based on the information sent to it by Altru. They don’t verify any of it. It’s meant to sell magazines, much like their university edition.
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U.S. News annually evaluates nearly 5,000 hospitals in 16 different medical specialties. Hard numbers stand behind its analysis in most specialties – death rates, patient safety, procedure volume, and other objective data. Physicians’ responses to a national survey, in which specialists are asked to name hospitals they consider best in their specialty for the toughest cases, are factored in.
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Sure they do. And how many employees do they have doing this? They take the info sent to them by hospitals, collate it, and never verify it. When’s the last time a USNWR reporter came to Altru, or the other 4999 hospitals to check them out? Universities learned this a long time ago. Some got caught lying. Others no longer participate. It’s all PR. You want to but into it, fine.
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Don’t you read? You are one of the most prejudiced/opinionated persons i’ve run across .
“Physicians’ responses to a national survey, in which specialists are asked to name hospitals they consider best in their specialty for the toughest cases, are factored in”.
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How would you know if USNews ever came to Altru or any other evaluation team. You talk through your hat to the point of terminal cynicism.
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So what’s your point…That because someone runs something positive about them we should look the other way while they try to make our area a no choice area? That doesn’t hold enough weight for that kind of blind confidence….Altru is not some wounderful saving grace for Grand Forks…..Personally….I find them an agressive force who is basically forcing themselves on the community and leaving few other options…
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Hey Hilary read the paper. Even doctors are agreeing. The services were already offered here by other practitioners and were now asked to leave so Altru could bring in their own doctors. I don’t think you are getting this. Altru is not competing with themselves. They are bringing doctors over here that already work at Altru. Ya Altru said they didn’t kick people out but that is an outright lie. If you are not from here or don’t know anyone who lives here or works here, your opinion is invalid and not much appreciated.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Mandi: Nasty. Nasty. I like to respond to the facts not the emotion. Probably why I don’t feel the need to attack you for your opinion. My opinion is just as valid as yours.
The buildings were purchased by Altru. Altru can do what they want with the buildings. They did not buy practices – so they did not fire anyone. From the first press release Altru said that they were bringing their own doctors over to the south side.
If Sanford (for example) bought the building that houses Hugo’s and Scheels (right across from Altru) they would ask those businesses to leave when the lease was up and then Sanford would offer services – the same services as Altru. Would you be angry at Sandford for “kicking out” Hugo’s and Scheels? Would you be angry at Sanford for bringing the same services as Altru and competing right across the street as Altru? Of course not. And that is a double standard.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
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Give me a break. Okay. Fine. If 6 months ago Aurora clinic decided to expand and bought the buildings and “kicked out” Hugos and Scheels. Would you be having the same discussion? In my example Aurora would have already had facilities on the south end. Would it be unfair that they came and competed with Altru right across the street from Altru. No – of course not. Would you be complaining that bad Aurora displaced Hugos and Scheels for there own gain. Of course not. Why because presumably it would make good business sense for Aurora (in my example). You are clouded by your hatred for Altru – as indicated by your name. So I will make more intelligent points if you can make more objective ones!
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Sanford does in fact have facilities here. They have a very nice building with very nice doctors located in East Grand Forks.
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Hilary, I am pretty sure that Hugos and Scheels are completely different than a medical facility. Now you are just talking nonsense. You are trying to make a point that just doesn’t make sense and frankly noone wants to hear anymore. I don’t want to sound like a jerk but peoples emotions are very much invested in this decision and if yours aren’t then no need to keep posting on this message board. All you are doing is making people more upset than they already are. This isn’t about a good business deal or if Altru made a good move for them. It’s about how our community wanted the option of a another hospital. And to see if it improved patient care at Altru. To see what kind of care they would receive and praying it would be better than what they received in the past. I don’t think it’s fair that option got taken away from us. I hope this helps you understand how we feel about this. I’m not trying to be nasty to you and I apologize if I got a little heated. It’s just a tough of subject for not only me but a lot of other people of Grand Forks.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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First, I understand you and others are emotionally involved in this issue. Just because I am not does not mean that I don’t have a right to weigh in. And perhaps I can be more objective. Statements like “no one wants to hear anymore” are emotional and not factual. You may not want to hear more from me, others perhaps do.
I agree that retail/grocery is different from medical facilities. I was trying to show the double standard that I see on some of the posts including yours.
In one of the posts you indicate that you are mad because there are independent offices that you feel can’t compete because Altru bought the buildings and now they will lose their jobs. You feel Altru already has facilities and should just stay where they are. They didn’t have to move into Aurora territory.
My point is that you are angry because it is Altru that moved in. If instead Aurora grew and expanded and purchased buildings in Altru territory (the Scheels building for example) you would not feel that it was unfair that Aurora would take business away from Altru nor would you be saying that it is unfair that the employees from Hugos and Scheels had to move the business or lose their jobs. You would say the owners of Hugos/Scheels shouldn’t have had a month to month lease and isn’t it great that Aurora expanded their services.
You are mad because it is Altru and if another business/medical facility did the exact same thing as Altru you wouldn’t be mad or think it was unfair or shady.
I am sorry you don’t feel like Grand Forks gives you the choice or options that you want/need. But, to me, it seems like the anger and disappointment should be directed at the first Aurora hospital that couldn’t get it up and running and the owners of the buildings who consciously and knowingly sold it to Altru. It is hard for me to fault Altru for making a business deal that they feel was good for them.
If there was a house in foreclosure and I bought it would that make me the bad guy? I am making a good investment for myself, but someone else is going to lose the house. Is it acceptable that the neighbors are now mad at me for buying the house and ‘kicking’ the old neighbors out?
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Wow, you really don’t deserve the abuse you are getting on this discussion board. Why do you keep posting?
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Don’t hate the player, hate the game. Here’s the deal, there is no such thing anymore as a free market for hospitals in the US, they are so expensive to run that startup organizations have a slim chance. Altru is not for profit instead of non-profit, so yes it is a private organization. Every hospital in the US recognizes that it must expand and be opportunistic or it will fail. The truth is that there is plenty of competition for Altru, just not in Grand Forks. Sanford has a stranglehold on Fargo, you can bet that they would eat Essentia for breakfast in a minute if they had the opportunity.
Bottom line, as a patient you are ALWAYS entitled to a second opinion.
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I have a really great mechanic. I can take my vehicles to him and I’ve learned to trust his opinion because he’s made repairs that cost mjuch less than the estimate because once he got in there he found thing were better than he thought and so he didn’t replace things that were doing just fine…Instead of just gouging me. I know if I ever felt he wasn’t being honest with me there’s plenty of other shops I can check out………
Yes you can get a second opinion, but with Altru buying up most of the local clinics it’s not really much of a second opinion. How do I know if the doctor takes one look at the charts and sees the first was from another Altru doctor and basically goes with the flow so he or she wont make waves? Granted that’s probably a bit above the boards, but you get my point……More choices is better for the customers….
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Ok dislikers….Sell me on how less choice is better for the customer….That’s the logic of my statement and since you dislike it then you must find having less choice as a better situation for people….So please don’t just “Dislike” Prove it to me…
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Since nobody wants to talk up then I guess the only conclusion for the dislikes is that you dislikers hate that I’m right and it just burns you up because you know it’s the truth……Message received….
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Come on….Grow a pair and do more than the coward’s “Dislike” click….Tell me where I’m wrong…..
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I didn’t like or dislike this one but have a comment to share…If a dr looks at a chart and sees that previous dr’s were from Altru and just goes with the flow, they are a lazy and crappy dr.
More choices are better and that is what Altru is trying to do. They have a lot of dr’s hired to come on board and need to make room for them. Are all the dr’s at Altru fantastic? Nope, but there is no medical facility in the world that has all fantastic dr’s. Are there some very good dr’s at Altru? There def. are.
I’ve had an awful dr who did surgery that actually made my medical issue worse. Went to Fargo and had to have three surgeries to correct the first one. Even though I’ve had that, I still don’t hate Altru for what they are doing. They are doing what they need to do to try to recruit the best dr’s. (Btw, I along with many others, filed formal complaints against the dr and he was fired so Altru does take action when it has reason to).
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Let me put it a different way…When I lived in the western part of the state the small city I was at only had one hospital and a couple clinics, but it was about a third of the size of GF (Don’t dare mention the city or it gets put into mod limbo) I had a doctor there try to talk me into a operation to clear my nasal passage….I went a hundered miles away to a doctor in the capital city to get a second opinion and this specialist told me that in his opinion that operation didn’t have a very good track record for sucess in the long term. So I didn’t get it…….
My concern with the present situation in GF is if every clinic is attatched to the hospital then how do you know that another doctor in the same system will be as honest and candid with you? I mean another doctor might get called on the carpet for talking me out of a big money operation…How do you know what goes on in the management when it’s all under the same name? For all I know doctor A has more years than doctor B but he likes raking in money for this operation. If doctor B knows this could make things rough for himself he might just take the easy way out and say…”It can’t really do you any harm (Providing I survive the operation that is)” That’s the bigger problem of everything under one management…
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I def get that and understand. I know my personal experience is that if I need a second opinion, I am going to head to a completely different place. I have no problem with driving an hour to Fargo to get that. Even if there was another option in GF, I personally would still drive to Fargo. I know others don’t want to have to drive and want to be able to stay in town here and I get that is what is upsetting. And I know the smaller towns will run into what you are talking about as they have an Altru clinic currently and GF is the next big city and it is 95% Altru.
But with Altru expanding and being affiliated with Mayo, that will help them to recruit better physicians. It does take a lot to get the cream of the crop and when Fargo is close by and Mayo not too far and in a bigger city, they get the better ones so Altru is doing what they can to compete with those places.
And at any place you go there will be dr’s that say surgery is option 1 and others that will have surgery as a last resort. That really is the dr and not necessarily the hospital/clinic. Of course the place of business will have it’s rules and regulations but after that it’s up to the dr. And you also have to remember that dr’s studied at different schools with different philosophies. Some of those schools will focus on surgery as the best option, some will focus on the holistic approach, and others will focus on other approaches. Every place will have good and bad dr’s. It’s just that in a smaller town, only the bad stories get told. But if the bad stories are just told and formal complaints aren’t filed, nothing can be done to discipline the dr.
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Altru has been pulling the wool over the eyes of the GF citizens for years. I seem to recall a huge “press conference” three or four years ago about an Altru expansion…it just happened to coincide with the announcement of a new hospital being built in GF. Why didn’t Altru start their big “announced” expansion then?? When it looked like the Doctors Hospital was going to be a “go” for sure, all of sudden Altru was going to “expand to South” by adding huge services in the Wellness Center and opening its own occupational and physical therapy services in a separate building…oh, but wait…now those plans have been put on hold since they were somehow able to “purchase” Aurora…anyone recognize a pattern here??? It’s just as much of a joke as their “partnership” with the Mayo. Really?? I hear only three departments from Altru can actually contact the Mayo: cardio, cancer, and neurology…exactly the very areas where Altru is having a difficult time finding more doctors… what the Mayo partnership really means is that Altru will not give you a referral to the Mayo when you want one…you almost have to threaten to get a lawyer before they’ll help you set it up…and, believe me, they aren’t very pleasant about it either! Oh…one more thing… when Aurora wanted to open — to have MORE BUSINESSES IN GRAND FORKS — the completely “objective” City Council would not offer them a requested tax abatement…money that would eventually be PAID BACK… and yet when Altru suddenly “purchases” the Aurora Hospital and Clinic, now they need bond help from the City even with their non-profit status…and not a whimper was heard from the City Council. It was passed with barely any news on it at all…oh, of course, guess who is the largest advertiser with the GF Herald and WDAZ???? I wonder why we never hear “real stories” about Altru… hmmm…
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Altru had a deal about the PT/OT at the wellness center from the beginning and had plans to have a new building out there for a while.
As far as Mayo, any dr at Altru, regardless of speciality is able to talk directly to Mayo. It has not been limited to certain areas. Whomever told you that is lying to you.
And as far as referrals, maybe instead of listening to all the rumors, you should check facts. There are actually more referrals to Mayo and it is easier to be transferred to Mayo. The partnership with Mayo has been an asset. There have been many patients that were a little more critical, Mayo was called, they gave advice to the dr’s here to try. If that stuff didn’t work, the dr at Mayo gladly accepted a transfer of the patient. That has saved some people from having to be transferred to Mayo and actually saving them money.
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Read more about bonds. Altru is not asking the city to help with bonds. Altru is issuing bonds. Altru will have to pay the money back. This does not cost the taxpayer anything. You are comparing apples to oranges.
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