Rental bikes could be coming to Grand Forks
April 6, 2012 at 3:39 pm in Grand Forks Herald
Online survey launched to gauge public interestRentable bikes could soon join buses on the list of public transportation options in Grand Forks if there is enough community interest, the city’s Greenway Specialist Kim Greendahl said Friday. Continue Reading
That seems like a pretty steep cost for an area where you might get four months of renting at best….And that’s just considering that there’d be a difinate drop once the weather turns cold, but with the ever increasing summer heat we’ve been having…That too would hamper very many rentals I’d think. Good idea for some places in the south, but I’m not so sure it’d pan out enough for the costs up here…
Hot debate. What do you think?
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I agree the season is to short and cost are to high. Maybe we could purchase some rental snowmobiles also, they can’t cost to much!
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Seriously….our hiking trails/bike paths are crowded with enough bike traffiic already. I hate the thought of adding more to it with tourists. When you walk along the river you have to constantly be aware of who is coming up from behind you. And if I have this right….you can rent a bike from Monty or Terry at the Ski & Bike shop.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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My first opinion on this was I don’t see a need for it. But the more I thought about it the more my opinion changed. The city has to go with the option where people can check in and out their own bikes though. Mostly because it will allow for 24 hour access and they won’t have to hire people to sit in a booth.
I know people will oppose this on the cost issue and short season but grand forks really needs things for tourists to do. This something that won’t draw people to grand forks but it is an activity for them to do. Instead of shopping at Walmart.
Also they could take this a step or farther and setup multiple rental locations around town and have route planned with signage to guide people on their bike grand forks.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Where would they go that’s worth all the pedalling to get there?
The “Grand Illusion” tour: Bike past the Alerus, the Fitness Center, the new elementary school, and then out to the new airport terminal. Hot damn, that’s entertainment. Afterwards, a quick snack and then lobotomies for everyone.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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” and then lobotomies for everyone.”
Too late. City leaders have already had them.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Thank you for the laugh! I totally agree! I have more fun on my spin bike than on our bike trails.. snoozville..
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Sounds like you want more hills so you can complain GF is too hilly.
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And watch the hourly race at the fitness center as people jocky for the closest parking spot to the door so they don’t have to walk very far to expercise….
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“officials do not plan to seek tax dollars to fund the project ”
Famous last words. When the project goes belly-up, first thing they’ll do is run to the city council for tax money.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Maybe the city council is going to pay for it out of their paychecks
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If the city council had followed that philosophy, there’d be no Alerus.
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Grammar notwithstanding, what a horrendously designed survey.
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Another in a long and sad series of boneheaded ideas backed by the City of Grand Forks.
Let private enterprise fulfill whatever “need” exists for rental bicycles.
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This has long been the modus operandi of Grand Forks: if the private sector won’t supply an amenity, generally because it’s a sure money-loser, the city will. Of course implicit in this is the idea that there will always be money to offset the financial losses. How much again is still owed on the Alerus?
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The last statement I had from the City (via Candi Stjern, Finance Dept) from June 13, 2011, was:
“The outstanding principal is $57,080,000 with the final payment due December 15, 2029.
The interest payments from 2011 through 2029 total $30,477,412.50.
So as of last June, we owed more than 87 million dollars on a project we were told would cost ~60 million.
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Schurkey, your math ignores the present value of money. Paying $87M of principal and interest over a period of 18 years is not the same as paying $87M today. For example, you would not give me $87 today in exchange for being paid $87 18 years from now; the use of that money for the next 18 years has value, usually measured in terms of interest. You might give me $60 today in exchange for $87 18 years from now. Similarly, when you buy a house for $100,000 the cost is $100,000 regardless of whether you get a mortgage or use cash; if you get a mortgage you’ll pay interest for the privilege using someone else’s money but if you use cash you’ll give up the opportunity to collect interest on your money; we can ignore the increase or decrease in the actual value of the house because it should be the same regardless of whether you have a mortgage or use cash. Now, if your complaint is that the City has a finite ability to service debt and the decision to use an excessive amount (or any) of that ability on the Alerus Center was wrong, I agree with you.
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My complaints are:
That GF blew a huge amount of money on a useless project;
That the project went 30% over budget which cannot happen by accident;
That we were not allowed to vote down the project when we voted to approve the cost over-run;
That we were lied to from beginning to end about the “economic development” it would provide;
That we were lied to about the amount of yearly subsidy it would devour;
AND that the president of the City Council REFUSED (!!!) to tell me how much interest would be paid over the life of the loan. He said “People don’t ask how much interest they’re going to pay on their house, I’m not going to say how much they’ll pay on this project.”
Therefore, the amount of interest–undisclosed prior to any vote–is a sore subject for me; as is the fact that none of them were prosecuted for malfeasance.
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If renting Bikes was a good Idea, some business would already be doing it.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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How about instead of rental bikes we talk about some sort of family entertainment – mini golf, laser tag, mini basketball (like in Bismarck), paintball, go karts, etc … any sort of outdoor (or indoor) entertainment for a family to do that’s not a greenway walk or a splash park … please???
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I see any of these options as more likely for a tourist family to be doing instead of a bike ride around run-of-the-mill-average-looking GF.
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They have mini golf in Fargo too so if they can survive there you’d think they could in GF….For years there was one around where Paridiso in now, thenthere was one out by the water slide, but I don’t think there’s been any others….Have there?
I have one more idea to add for tourist….Two person paddleboats for when the Red isn’t flowing too fast during the summer….Then again the insurance for something like that might be through the roof…
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Fargo can support mini golf because Fargo doesn’t suck like grand forks. Much more to do in Fargo for people who actually like to do stuff…
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Are you aware the Canad Inn water park is open to the public for a fee just like the hotel guests have to pay. It is the only water park of its size in ND. The wisdom of the GF city council was to let the private sector build it after they thought about building it themselves. There is no complex like the Alerus/Canad complex between Mpls. & Seattle.
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Private sector, my tuckus.
How much did Canad pay for the land they built on? How much money was given to them for advertising reimbursement?
Canad Inn is up to their eyeballs in Corporate Welfare stolen from the Grand Forks area, and handed to a foreign corporation.
A mistake from beginning to end.
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Does the waterpark generate a part of the $15 mill. in city sales tax, of course. Does every private sector GF business get subsidies from the taxpayers? of course. It’s called infrastructure. Does GF have a publically accessible water park for a small price compared to what it would have cost? Yes.
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What wisdom? The city council was fully prepared to pour taxpayer money into a water park, despite the fact years earlier it took a bath (pun intended) on the waterslide. As I’ve said, these businessmen would never put their own capital into such a project. But since it isn’t their money it’s ok.
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there used to be batting cages on South Washington years ago, they didnt last.
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There was also a trampoline park about where Paridisio is. The tramps were flush with the ground, i.e. a pit underneath, so falls happened horizontally to deal with insurance.
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There was also a beautiful minor league ballpark at the corner of Wash. & Demers where the curling & hockey rinks are. It had a great grandstand and seating down the lines that would hold about 5000 fans to see the likes of Hank Aaron, Willie Stargell, Roger Maris, Yogi Berra etc. in the old Northern League with Winnipeg, Fargo, Sioux Falls, Aberdeen, St. Cloud, Duluth etc. GF has always been a great/grand town.
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Was… Now it just sucks.
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Apparently a short biking season isn’t a factor considering Mpls. has an extensive public bike rental op. What is a factor is enough people to support it. As far as other rec. ideas there is a TC metro golf driving range facility that is covered where the golfers hit from under an overhead heating system into the outdoor landing area. Attached to this facility is an 18 hole indoor mimi- golf course abutted by another outdoor grass green mini- course.
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As with most new ideas this proposal is met with a dull thud by the usual negative bloggers. These bikes work great in Minneapolis/St. Paul. They’de be great for tourists, students here for the summer and out of town visitors coming to GF to see relatives. Also good for local residents that don’t have bikes or a place to store them. You pick a bike up and ride it around town or over to Minnesota. When you’re done you drop it off and pay for the time used. You can start out small and make it bigger if it needs more bikes. It’s a great idea. A healthy activity that doesn’t require gasoline, is quiet and can be used from spring until late fall. Join the rest of the world and come into the sunshine. Don’t let the curmudgeons keep Grand Forks from being a better place to live and visit.
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Right, the TC is the bikingest city in the US 2nd only to Portland, Ore., I believe. GF/EGF has a great bike trail system so it is a natural amenity to have bikes available to tourists to be able see the river upclose.
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If you want to sink your money into this investment then by all means go for it….I know I was only estimating that the high cost for this with the relitivly short season probably wouldn’t make it pay off, but who knows….Maybe it would get people coming out of the woodwork who don’t own their own bikes and thus will have the upmost respect when using a rental….But if you want to invest in this service then best of luck to you…
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In Minneapolis, there are so many things within a small area. If you live downtown in GF and need toilet paper, you need to pedal down to a Hugo’s or Walmart. Not six blocks to the downtown target. You are like most GF residents stuck in that boring town. Only thinking about the tourists and visitors since they are the life blood of grand forks. A town with no attractions won’t last as a tourist town. Retail business is killing GF and lowering the wages in a “city” where the cost of living is higher than anywhere else in ND that isn’t an oil field… The last thing you mentioned were the residents. You should be pushing your community leaders to attract some businesses that pay more than $9/hr to bring some growth to that stagnant boring town.
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You’re right about the Twin Cities. Once we got the hang of the area we quickly learned to love it. It has a vibe that GF doesn’t. The people are friendly and there is so much to do.
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Rental bikes would be a great deal. Set up a few automatic stations along the bike trail where you check in and out with a credit/debit card. Great way to produce income for our park system on the canadian dollar!
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Are you seriously comparing GF with Minneapolis, and therefore Portland?! Astounding!
Yes, I love to get close to that murky brown water, and better yet, get closer to the mosquitos and the rotting vegetation smell from the EGF processing plant. See, folks, that’s the thing…other cities, including MSP, have “stuff” to look at and do near their rivers, downtowns, etc. We have nowhere near the amenities that other cities have. It’s completely useless to compare GF/EGF to large urban areas.
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We’re not comparing. I hope you realize the TC are seen as an armpit by both coasts. At any rate the point is “descendent” I was referring to the fact that cold weather doesn’t prevent Mpls. from being 2nd only to Portland as having the most active bikers. GF is cold like the TC so a public biking op. isn’t out of the question. You need to quit being so literal minded & think in more complex terms instead of a knee jerk desire to put down.
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GF is on the same latitude as Grand Marais. How many people there are biking in the winter?
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Actually down by the water where Grand Marais is the temp. is moderated by the unfrozen Lake Superior.
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My question was how many people bike in Grand Marais in the winter?
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Actually, inside the breakwater the lake does freeze, as does well out from the shoreline where the lake is shallow.
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GM with a pop. of 1,300 & little traffic & warmer lakeside temps I would say a higher % bike than in most places with a winter. In the TC bikers have special winter biker’s clothing & studded tires.
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As long as the main lake doesn’t freeze the temps are warmer in GM than GF.
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http://mntrails.com/content/how-winter-bike
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You would say. But the question is Grand Forks, which has a long tradition of spending money on boondoggles. You don’t even live here, so you don’t subsidize the Alerus everytime you eat at a restaurant or buy a bottle of wine. And the Alerus is the symbol of Grand Forks spending. Renting bikes, like the dog park, ftiness center, and all the other expenditures, represents one more example of the the whole city paying for a the whims of a few.
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My family & I pays taxes in GF. I eat in its restaurants & stay in its hotels.
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If you are right about GF boondoggles then GF is like every other city on the continent & your analysis is meaningless. So how many bikers are there in Grand Marais?
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It’s your blanket statement that’s meaning less. As for bike riders in GM, that was my question for you.
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The fact that you call my post a blanket statement only reveals your all around Libertarian attitude that govt. can’t do anything right. You would whine about city spending wherever you lived on the the planet. Your radical individualism is what Tocqueville said would be the downfall of the Republic.
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Oh cut the BS. You apply boondoggles across the world, yet supply nothing to back up your assertion. Plus you live comfortably down in the Twin Cities, free from the financial consequences of GF city council decisions. A trip up here a couple times a year doesn’t make you a citizen of grand forks.
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I spend about 25 days a year in GF & have made 175 trips there over the past 35 yrs. What makes you think there aren’t boondoggles in the 100 TC burbs, each with its own city council. They make any problem in GF look like child’s play when it comes to corruption. You don’t know how good you have it in your myopic world.
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How odd. I lived on the East Coast for nearly 30 years and heard no such thing.
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And your personal experience is an accurate reflection of how the coasts see the Midwest & Mpls? Unlike you I love this region. It is laughable you come from the east & belittle GF & yet never heard deprecating remarks about the TC. Your use of “astounding & odd” indicates it doesn’t take much to surprise you.
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But I do love this region. I truly do. I just hate the mosquitos and the sewage smell that makes it difficult to be outside for much of the summer.
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I was just in New Orleans listening to the locals whine about how they dread the thought of the summer heat coming. If they could they would love to be in GF for the summer. Maybe Marilyn’s restaurant reviews will get them here.
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Forks might have less land marks you apparently thik are the criown jewel of touring the cities, but if all you see is as described by you here….Then you’re not really seeing much. I haven’t done it for years, but you could take a mountain bike along the Red from the city to Lincoln golf course and it was a damn nice run…Especially early morning or late night….And guess what…You didn’t have to worry too much about the two legged animals you might meet along the way. The same goes with pretty much the rest of the town…..There’s a certain comfort and freedom about being able to go pretty much wherever you please with little wory about ending up in a high crime district.
As for mosquitos….Well everyone knows MN has no such thing as mosquitos….Ya right.
As for the Crystal Sugar smell….Generally in spring after the thaw for a week or so….Most likely not during the time that biking gets into full swing….Ya it’s a stench, but locals generally learn to try to ignore it for that week and get one with their lives….It’s the transplant who usually act as if they’re being gassed or something……
There’s a lot of nice areas in Forks…Hell go through some of the older streets from Reeves to Cherry or so and enjoy the catherdral appearance of the old trees on both sides of the streets merging towards the middle….And once again do it in the comfort of not having to worry about running into a high crime area, because in Forks there’s not really any high crime area per se.
Yes…We’re not the cities sith lakes and other attractions, but then we don’t try to be…..I think we’re comfortable enough being a big town where we enjoy the freedom of not having to look over our shoulder in a lot of places……
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I’ve gotten more mosquito bites in my yard than I have biking/kayaking along the Greenway
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Since it such an armpit and there is “nothing to do”. Why don’t you just leave descendant! Gf is a beautiful city with plenty of opperunities for a city its size.
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Now, there’s a well-reasoned reply, the “If you complain so much you should leave.”
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Fargo considered rental bikes, any success there? At best this type of business would struggle for success in GF. At one time, UND placed several bikes painted green around campus, a FREE service.
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But theres no way to have free bikes these days.. As a resident of GF you cant even leave your bike in your front yard for more than a minute or someones stealing it. Maybe they should just use all the bikes from the police auction, theres hundreds every year!
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I believe the free bike service at UND was referred to as the green movement or something in that nature. This event was around 2007.
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Oh spearman the eastcoast is the armpit of the world! They just don’t know what real living can be.
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Has anybody been near the Greenway today? The smell is atrocious.
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Even in the TC some undesirable things seem to be unavoidable like the garbage burning plant behind the main grandstand at Target Field. People have complained about the smelly trucks making their way to the inside dumping area. BTW don’t forget, however we feel about the poison that sugar is, its processing odor is the smell of money in GF.
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Don’t worry- when the sugar farmers lose their protections and subsidies under the next farm bill, American Crystal will go belly up, and that smell will be a thing of the past.
Unfortunately, so will be a large economic engine for our community. But hey- no more nasty smell!
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Decendant, I want making a juvenile argument, you just seem to be unhappy here and cannot find the beauty the city acctually has. I was just making a suggestion that if your unhappy here your always free to leave, we won’t miss you. That smell down by the river this morning was the beet plant not the river. Mosquitos and stagnant water are part of the natural ecosystem of the red river and it hasn’t even been bad this year. I was not here pre 1997 but the best thing this town ever did was create the greenway when they put up the dike! If it was miserable and disgusting it would not receive the amount of traffic it recieves on a daily basis. My suggestion to you is to leave this city if it is so misserable!
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OK, I’ll play. 1) I am always telling my friends that you have to look for the beauty here, that it doesn’t just smack you over the head like a mountain range. The flatness lends a unique wonder, and an unparalleled “see forever” aspect. Additionally, I have never seen as many beautiful sunsets as I have seen here. Charles M. Russell would be jealous. The ND Badlands are my favorite National Park, as well. Please tell me again how I think there is beauty here. 2) Please show me where I said the river was the source of the smell. I’d be interested to see how you came up with that one. Of course the plant is the smell. It’s been ruining my summers for years. 3) The mosquitoes haven’t been bad this year because it’s April, and it was 19 degrees this morning. All of that said, I think the Greenway is a beautiful place, and use it quite a bit, especially since I live so close to it. However, everything I have stated thus far in this thread still remains fact.
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Talking out of the otherside of your mouth now, descendant? You really should run for political office
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I am sorry that my sentences confuse you. I will try to write more like Marilyn Hagarty so that you will understand. Where did I say that there was no beauty here? Where did I say that the smell was coming from the river? Let’s start with those easy questions, and we will work our way up from there. I await your inevitable “If it’s so bad you should leave” response.
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Let’s see post 1 get closer to the merky water andother cities have “stuff” to look at. Later on anyone been near the greenway to day the smell was terrible. I am always telling my friends you have to look for the beauty I am sorry that you can’t just see it, but you do admit to seeing it. You said all these things sounds to me like yo9u have to complain about something.
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I called the water “murky,” not “merky.” It is murky. The sediment load of the Red is extremely high. Are you disputing this? The rest of your post makes such little sense that I will not even address it.
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Before agriculture the RR & RLR were red. What say to that
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I am not sure if this is addressed to me, but I will answer it. I don’t care if the river ran blue, then yellow, then polka dot. Fact: It is murky today.
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I don’t like the murky water either but you have to admit the connection between plowed fields growing beets and the look of murky water & beet plant odor is the look & smell of money.
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THE TRUTH COMES OUT on television!
This article says “officials do not plan to seek tax dollars to fund the project”. But it also says “funding for a rack system would probably come from transportation grants”
Seems like general funding for this mess will come from “transportation grants”.
What are “transportation grants”? In this case, they’re the legal–but unethical–diversion of TAX DOLLARS paid by motorists at the fuel pump. The fuel taxes should be spent maintaining the roads used by the vehicles that burn the fuel, but instead they’re siphoned off to provide facilities that have no relationship to the taxed fuel.
In short, this WILL be paid for by tax dollars…just not the fund you’d expect it to come from.
There is NO source of public funding that isn’t succeptable to an unconscionable raid. it seems. Politicians have made sure that money can be mis-used even when it’s a specific class of taxpayer who expects to get a fair return for his taxation.
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Actually Shurkey if you think about this in a more complex way you would understand fewer cars on the road & more bikes equals less road upkeep/congestion/air pollution. That’s better for all drivers.
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So this money is diverted from Fed. gas taxes? Even if true we have to do everything possible to cut down on greenhouse gases so it is justified.
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Woof. You bought in to the corrupt “scientists” that have been PROVEN to have fudged the data they presented us?
The rental bikes are not going to be used by “commuters” because any commuter with a brain will buy their own bike. This is being set up because it’s trendy, and maybe we can capture some “tourist” dollars by having Winnepeggers pedaling around town.
If there was a viable market for it, private enterprise would already be doing it. The fact that some bonehead has to make a public-funded case of it proves that it won’t be popular enough to justify.
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Yes…Isn’t it amazing how fox noise has been able to get so much milage out of a few who played a bit with a few numbers, while totally ignoring the hundreds who have launched well researched studies all over the world who have came to the conclusion that we’ve basically already put ourselves so deep into the comode that even a total revesal at this point probably wont chnage the devistation to come……So will you be convienced when you’re world has collasped around you and you know that there are no further tomorrows?
However…I do agree with most of the rest of your points…
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It has been disproved that they fudged data. I guess using your logic if roads, bridges, schools were worth doing private enterprise would have done it.
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Fudged climate data
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/jul/08/muir-russell-climategate-climate-science
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Shurkey beleives the big bad government needs to go away and leave the “private buisness sector” alone. How dare anyone be forced to pay their fair share and play on an evenfield. If the government went away buisness would flurish and all the coroption in the world would go away!
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Your the one who made the statements that made such little sense buddy!
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