Crystal hiring replacement workers locally
November 21, 2011 at 4:38 pm in Grand Forks Herald
Management says still hope to bring back union workersFor now, it’s looking to hire more replacements, but hope to save on more from not having to pay room-and-board for out-of-town workers. One executive said American Crystal now recognizes that lock-out of union workers will last much longer than anticipated. Continue Reading
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Can you hear that? The fat lady is singing!
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Even the fat lady has a job.
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**Meanwhile, Crystal officials released a letter Monday from the National Labor Relations Board dated Nov. 16 denying an appeal by the union of a dismissal in September of their claim that Crystal was not bargaining in good faith.
That buttresses the company’s claims it is acting in good faith, Ingulsrud said.
Riskey said the NLRB denied a similar appeal by Crystal about the union’s good faith.**
Where can a person view the rejected appeal Riskey is referring to? The company releases documents and posts them on their site. The rejected appeal letter the company just released says that the NLRB didn’t simply dismiss the union’s appeal, but that it was “substantially denied”. Pretty significant.
So where is the denied appeal Riskey refers to? Let’s see the reason for the alleged appeal, and the language of the alleged appeal denial.
Of course the union will say now that they’re “not surprised” their appeal was denied (again), and will attempt to minimize the impact of that decision and claim it means nothing. Since they brought the initial complaint to the NLRB though, and then appealed that earlier decision, it’s apparent to anyone with the ability to think clearly that they DO care about what the NLRB thinks of the whole situation. They just “care less” when things don’t turn out like they want.
Typical.
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While I’m sitting in my chair outside the gates …
On another thread we were discussing my son volunteering for a second tour in Afghanistan because he can’t live on the $9 an hour he gets stocking shelves at Sam’s (no bennies). $15 an hour plus bennies, I text him & told him to get his ass in gear post haste.
No getting shot at, no living in a man camp with a bunch of drunks & meth heads in Williston, & just maybe a chance to start getting ahead.
If this works out I will stop by & give the guy in the chair a thank you card.
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I thank your son for his service and your sacrifice as well. I suggest your son consider using his military benefits to further invest in himself to improve his market worth in the work place. I just wish more of our service people would take advantage of, and we as a country would better support, the future of our military vets as they finish their service and look to their future. I would much rather we spend our taxes on this than some unneeded research project or politicians wages and benefits.
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You and me both Glen. Several poor decisions (the decision to make my grandson was bad, but the end result beautiful) have narrowed his options considerably (child support is 40% of your income till you die or they graduate HS). I am working with him on a plan that will get him a marketable skill AND meet his obligations.
Thank you for your kind words.
Paul
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I can’t for the life of me figure out why ACS even WANTS union workers back! All they are is a pain in the you know what!
Good question Scott, where IS the union letter?
Hang in there Jeff, The union will prevail…hahaha
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Actually smart guy, it’s a Constitutionally Limited Democratic REPUBLIC. Don’t forget it!
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Good for ACS! Finally time to start moving on. The union doesn’t want ACS to negotiate. They want ACS to capitulate. Big difference.
The replacement workers have shown ACS that they don’t need union labor and all the headaches that come with it. I’m sure that have been growing pains as there will be any time you immediately replace 100% of your staff. But the beets were harvested and now they’re being processed.
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We needed sugar for Thanksgiving and I spent a little extra to buy Crystal, instead of the store brand. You really think buying cane sugar helps anything? At least now buying Crystal sugar will help local workers again. Do you know how cane sugar is grown and harvested? Alot of cheap labor and illegals.
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Since this whole fiasco started, I now exclusively buy Crystal Sugar.
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Same here Kodiak.
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mis amigos de México pueden ahora subir y ayudar con referencia a pueble el River Valley rojo como nuestros abuelos y grande – los abuelos tenían, como nómadas Gracias Berg!
I say to my amigos to come to the Red River Valley and find permanent homes. Senior Berg promised we might be permanent and he is a man true to his word! Gracias, Moocho!
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Wow John….thats gonna hurt.
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“This whole thing has been badly handled by Crystal”…..The NLRB affirmed in their ruling as evidence of ACSC’s good faith negotiations, ” The clarity in outlining objectives” ..”.Willingness to modify subcontracting language”;..”.Responsive to all information requests from the union”;….and” significant movement on ACSC’s last two proposals”…. The NLRB said the unions negotiations were characterized with phases like…”Repeatedly refused to consider”….Virtually no counterproposals”…and “Few if any concessions”….Now I have to ask you John; Who has handled this badly? PLEASE hold you union reps to the same standard…if what you want is to STAND IN SOLIDARITY WITH YOUR UNION BROTHERS AND SISTERS….PLEASE be sure it is not percieved as standing in “STUPIDITY” with them…..the union WILL NOT win this one…it is over and if you truly want your brothers and sisters to be able to go back to their jos; you should be asking the union leadership a whole lot of questions; don’t settle for the bull they have handed to you…make them accountable!!!
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Let me translate for union members: your union has been busted.
If you ever want to work for Crystal again you need to accept the deal on the table or quit the union and apply for your old position reclassified as non-union.
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$50,000/year to start with 87% of health insurance paid is hell of a lot better than a living wage – unless your a union goon who feels entitled to a new pickup truck and snowmobile each year because they “work hard”.
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They will have job advancement based on their productivity and not on seniority. Why are the union employees so against this philosophy?
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The deal that was on the table expired November 1st. There is no deal or even a table for that matter.
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Union employees: has Steve Bertelli (your BCTGM Vice President) shared with you how much the Keokuk employees in Iowa lost in wages and benefits after being locked out for 8 months….they actually ended up with a lot less than the company at first offered…think hard on what is being offered because I am sure the offer will be going down…Crystal is setting their workforce up to last this out…Probably will last this whole campaign
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It seems the longer this goes on the bigger babies the union members are. ACS has stood pretty firm this whole time and they have not changed how they feel. They have even offered to change things to help bring this to a close. The union should be ashamed of its leaders and hopefully they realize this. The whole time we have heard this is not about money but about job security, but when ACS changes the contract to address this it is still voted down. It is about money and always has been. The workers are greedy and hopefully ACS can move on without them. I am glad to hear local people will be hired now.
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Lol… I have not watched that show since I was a kid, but back then I actually asked my Mom why Bob Cratchet didn’t just get a different job. I believe she told me something about him not being able to find another job. Clearly, I was too young to understand the message, but my initial instinct was to think that Scrooge was a bad boss and that it was no wonder he only had one person that was willing to work for him.
I also asked my Mom why Bob had so many kids if he was so poor he couldn’t afford to take care of them.
Ironically, at this point, my family was rather poor. I am sure the irony was not lost on my Mom that according to my own logic, I should have never been born.
Thanks for the Christmas story reference. I think I will watch it again. It is healthy for me to remember that sometimes life is not as simple as I make it out to be.
Merry Christmas everyone. I really do hope this gets figured out soon.
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Really? You are comparing people who make more than the market demands, and who also get free health insurance to Bob Cratchet? I just think it is sad that the union members keep listening to the union “leaders” like they are gods. Come on people, wake up!
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I did watch “A Christmas Story”. The kid wanted an Official Red Ryder Carbine-Action Two-Hundred-Shot Range Model Air Rifle. But everyone told him he’d shoot his eye out. And you know what? He almost lost an eye.
The boy was warned about the consequences of his desires, yet he insisted upon what he wanted. The union was told that not agreeing to a contract would lead to a lockout, yet they are surprised that a lockout occurred after repeatedly refusing offers from ACS.
I think that relates here just as much as your intended movie, “A Christmas Carol”.
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hahahaha, Phil M. I was thinking the same thing.
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Now it is Scrooge and Bob Cratchets Fault? When are you going to run out of people to blame for this?
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I have a question for the union people out there. What do you consider “negotiating in good faith” to mean? Please, don’t say, “it isn’t XXXX” or “It certainly isn’t YYYY”. I am not interested in what it is NOT. I want to know what it IS.
Is it only the responsibility of the company to negotiate in good faith? Do you hold the union to the same standard of good faith negotiations? If so, can you give me a specific example of something the union did that the company didn’t do that would clarify to me why the union is negotiating in “good faith” and ACS is negotiating in “bad faith”?
I am just trying to understand this whole process, and coming from a state where there really are no unions in the private sector, it is a little foreign to me.
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I wonder how many will still be in this union when the campaign is completed and haven’t worked a day during the process. Will there be any more negotiations? I doubt it.
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We want to work for mucho dinero $dollars not pesos as in Mexico. We glad we now have permanent jobs!
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we work hard and want to live as neighbors to all. Our children play sports go to school. Help all.
In my country there is a saying. A caballo dado, no le busques el colmillo. That mean you does not look a gift horse in the mouth.
Also Al mal tiempo, buena cara which says in bad times put on a happy face. We work hard for our good hombre senior Berg. Viva le sugar comapny!
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I will preface this by saying that I believe the union should have accepted Crystal’s deal. It was a fair offer. With that said, I truly hope this union busting effort by Crystal doesn’t blow up in their face. Republicans have always been iffy on their support of the sugar program. If the sugar bill loses the support of Democrats due to these anti union efforts, that would be a complete disaster. Without the sugar program in place, this whole labor dispute is akin to rearraging deck chairs on the Titanic.
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You are right, if the Sugar bill goes away, so do the sugar beets. This would be a moot point.(the lockout) I hope the industry is able to stay in the valley.
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Citori,
Loss of the Sugar Program (inevitable) will certainly cause ACS and its members to take a hit, but it will not be as bad as you say. The numbers floated last time this subject came up were 25% decrease, which means at least one quarter fewer jobs (union or non union).
The demise of the sugar program has been talked about before, and now with the budget crisis the farm program in general is in deep trouble. It is likely it (the farm program) will be negotiated away to soften the blow to Medicare.
I believe ACS knows this and that is why they are going to the wall on the outsourcing issue. The union members were foolish and their leadership negligent. ACS guaranteed no reclassification and no union losses. Only new positions would be affected. This is necessary to keep the job losses at 25%. If you add on the new automated machinery that will be critical to surviving in a non price supported marketplace. The cost of sugar will take a big dip the first few years until the market equilibrates. There is not a chance in hades ACS will survive using the same amount of employees and the same equipment. They will have to modernize to newer equipment that uses a fraction of the current workforce.
Until now ACS has not had a reason to do this, which is unfortunate. This process should have begun a decade ago. Now that their feet are held to the fire it will be much more disruptive than it needed to be, but make no mistake, it will happen.
ACS will be lucky to employ 600 people a decade from now.
I have said it before: I hope the locked out workers are using their down time productively, like retraining. Instead of outmoded and idiotic seniority and job security provisions, the union should have been negotiating for retraining dollars.
I guess all of the union reps flunked history. The experiences of the auto industry seem to be falling on deaf ears.
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With all due respect, flyingnurse, I don’t believe you understand what the complete elimination of the US sugar program would mean to the entire US sugar industry (both cane and beet). I will concede that it’s true that as we speak, world sugar prices are at nearly all time highs, and since about 2009 American Crystal and other sugar companies have had little need for governmental price supports. However, from the early 80′s until this recent price spike, there is a snowballs chance in Hawaii that the US sugar industry could have survived without import controls and government loan programs. Foreign produced sugar was way too cheap. If (and when, in my opinion) world prices of sugar return to pre 2009 levels, and if we lose the US sugar price support program between now and then, I don’t see any way that domestic production of sugar could survive. When sugar prices were down to price support levels 5 or 6 years ago, there were growers who were doing everything they could to get out of growing contracted sugar beet acres. And that was with price supports in place. Without those price supports, no one would even plant sugar beets. These factories would sit idle. Don’t think it can happen? Ask Manatoba farmers how many beets they have planted since Canada lost their quota to sell into the price supported United States market in 1996. Their factory closed and no beets have been planted ever since. Canada now gets 90% of their sugar from raw cane imported from tropical countries mostly in Central America. Thinking that American Crystal could survive by getting leaner and meaner is a pipe dream.
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You very well could be right Citori. Your argument is strong and you obviously have an insider’s knowledge. My question: would the end of the sugar industry as we know it be 100% bad?
I give you it would cause a disruption of biblical proportions throughout the upper mid west, but is sugar the only crop we are capable of growing? Tariffs are never a good thing because it encourages other countries to place tariffs on our goods heading in their direction. So, in order to save sugar we damage textiles. The end result is no one wins.
I know for a fact our farmers are the most productive group of entrepreneurs in the world. I would like to think they have what it takes to adapt and move on. Will it be easy? No, but it is possible.
I keep referring back to the auto industry. They had twenty years notice that life was changing and they chose to ignore it. By doing so they doomed not only an entire segment of the economy, but several million workers and entire geographic areas. Want to buy a house in Detroit?
If change is inevitable, take the steps to prepare for it. The farm program has been sacrosanct for over 50 years. I have a nasty feeling its time is up.
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flyingnurse, let me try and explain it this way. I have read some of your posts, and I believe that you work in the medical industry. So, in order to work in the field that you have chosen, you are required to attend training, become licienced, and you are scrutinized by a regulatory system that insures that you are performing your job in a manner that is consistent with the standards of the medical industry. For this you are paid for your services. Now you may compete against other hospitals, clinics, etc… but you compete against them under the same set of laws and regulations. What if a group of doctors and nurses and pilots from Central America moved into the area and set up shop providing the same services that you provide. But here’s the catch, they don’t need to comply with any of the regulations that you do. They don’t need to be licienced, they don’t need any training. They use substandard equipment and unsterile precedures. And they don’t answer to the US court system if they screw up. Because of this they can charge half of what you do for the same services, and still make more profit than you. Eventually they drive you out of business. Sure, a few people probably died in the process, but the free economy won out, right?
This is very much like what it would be like if we just said to heck with the US farm program (the sugar program being part of that). They are able to grow sugar cheaper in Central America, but what chemicals will they use to produce it? Are those chemicals tested by the EPA to insure they are safe? Does the FDA regulate and inspect how the sugar cane is processed? Does OSHA insure that the proper safety measures are being taken to insure worker safety?
The US Farm program exists to insure that the food we eat in this country is safe, easily available, and resonable in cost. The last thing we want is for our country to become more and more dependent on foreign sources for our food, fuel, building materials, etc… It is in our national interest to remain sovereign in as many of these essentials as we can. At least that’s how I see it.
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Pete, sugar is not subsidized. The price is held artificially higher in the US through import quotas and domestic production controls. Without these, the price of sugar would almost certainly be lower. Presumably a lower price would translate into people eating more sugar. So, the current US sugar program actually discourages the per capita intake of sugar.
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You know i’ve heard a lot about this can deeply jeopardize the sugar bill.. So then I sat and thought about it.. If we only produce 40% of the sugar out of the 100% produced in the united states is that enough to really jeopardize the program? There is still 60% out there that isn’t effected by what is happening with the ACS and how likely is it that anything will happen?
I’m thinking it is more empty scare tactics than anything.
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Maverick,
It is not our labor dispute that is threatening the farm/sugar bill, it is the philosophical change taking place in congress. Most of the new guys are more free market minded than their predecessors. ND congressional delegation used to have seniority, now we are the new kids on the block. Plus, how can Hoeven and Berg vote for farm subsidies and still maintain their Republican street credibility.
Add to that the budget stalemate and my guess is the farm bill (of which sugar is a part) will be sold down the river to lessen the blow to Medicare. I could be wrong, it would not be the first time, but I think the farm bill is toast regardless of how our labor situation turns out. The union only wishes they could use it as leverage. ACS can read the writing on the wall as well as anyone. There is no need to cave, the farm bill is gone or drastically reduced regardless of what they do.
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fn I completely understand. Berg I have no doubt that he will vote against Farm Subsidies, it is a well known fact that he is against them… Hoeven is much more of a moderate and I don’t think he will vote against, ultimately canceling each other out. The rest? Not so sure.. I strongly feel that most of the new group, just like the incumbents are more about lining their pockets vs what is good for the country.
While there are a lot of ‘New Kids on the Block’ I am not so certain how that will play out. There are no certainties in life except for death and taxes.
While I am not an advocate of the farm program, I have had quite a few comments voted down because of it… I have even in the discussions about the current dispute said that I felt that ACS was figuring this was going to happen and was one of the many factors in their current decision making. I am not quite as certain of that eventuality. Only time will tell I guess.
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You know it my friend. Like I said, I have been wrong before. I would hope the farm bill would be phased out over the next 5-10 years, giving the farmers and factories a chance to retool. A 100% cancellation overnight would be disastrous. That said, if the Republicans stick to their “everything must be paid for” guns, it is certainly possible.
On another thread I commented on the budget stalemate and the mandatory cuts facing both sides of the isle. My comment was it is never smart to do brain surgery with a meat cleaver, but that is what they have chosen to do. It will be interesting to see how it will all turn out.
I hope I still have a job
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Pot meet kettle????
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Of course you love to fight, fight, fight, ……you decided not to work and have nothing better to do.
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Made sure I stocked up on sugar for the holidays.. Going to be making a lot of extra cookies and bars to donate to the food shelters.
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They won’t have to worry about that anytime soon if the employment terms are similar to the last contract offer.
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Scooter; you say cheap labor…..starting at $15 with full benefits cheap labor? Yes, they can form a union at any time…who cares? I have never said all unions are bad but when they think they have the power to take over and run the factory then it is time to go……This is actually becoming rather silly…The union employees have trashed the company, and management; they have repeatedly said how terrible working for Crystal is so I cannot understand why they just don’t move on and quit with the poor me attitude…Believe me if my 20 years at Crystal had been as bad as they claim I would not have stayed….busting the union and taking back control of the company is 2 different things
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I thought someone would have posted a link to the “rejected appeal” Riskey referred to by now. It’s only been 14 hours or so since I originally asked.
Then again, it could be that Riskey wasn’t referring to a “rejected appeal” at all. It could be that it was just another statement thrown out there in the hope that nobody would call him on it. It’s not like it hasn’t been done, (several times), before.
C’mon union fans…get him on the phone. I just want to see a link. If it indeed exists, I’ll acknowledge it and thank you for the info. If it doesn’t, well…..
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I am here Winston Cooper. Company spokerman, I am not, nor am I a company spokesman.
Did you really say:
“The Flying Nurse lives in Bullhead City Arizona. You’re correct in saying He, The flying nurse, doesn’t fully understand the complexities at hand.”
Are you not from Virginia?
What do you understand about the complexities at hand?
This is a sad state of affairs, the employee’s are like a herd of sheep following the lead sheep off the side of a cliff, just because the lead sheep said it was the right path to take.
I think Pete’s statement below sums it up for the majority of non ACS employee’s, when he says at the start he sympathized, then as time goes and the more you learn the sympathy disappears.
I really feel embarrassed for the people I know, they only listen to each other, they only believe what a Riskey Froemke tell them to believe.
Now they have their own food pantry?
Its become pathetic.
No more sympathy here. Get a job, and get a life.
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Well Winston Cooper I didn’t say it did, you pointed out Flyingnurse wasn’t from the Red River Valley, I pointed out you were not either. Flyingnurse has stated he lived here at one point and still has family here. Have you have blessed the Red River Valley with your presence?
I do not find it acceptable that others destroy anyone’s livelihood, I did not say that. I think it is saddening to watch good people destroy their own livelihoods, it is very sad. And for what? ACS has amended this contract at least three different times to satisfy the union, and they just find something else to pick apart. I have heard from people that said everything in the last contract was fine except the word eligible. Eligible? Well eligible meant that the unionized piler crews could not return to work if the November contract was ratified. Would you like to know why Winston Cooper? I know, but I will tell you anyway, because their job was done by replacement workers, and they were no longer needed for the 2011 harvest. Why would ACS want them there if they wouldn’t have been there this time of year if there wouldn’t have been a lock out? If you knew anything about the RRV or ACS you would know that. But you are just a union toad with a keypad that thinks it is okay for a group of people to be out of work and soon homeless, just so the union doesn’t have to look weak.
Its okay winston cooper your from Virginia you don’t understand how us narrow minded folk think.
I am happy that the union organizations in Minneapolis-St Paul are involved in helping the locked out workers, they should be, this is their doing. They should pay their mortgages too.
I will be honest with you I think they should get unemployment in ND too, but just for the months of August thru November. After that they should have had a job and have moved on with their lives.
Its pretty simple Winston Cooper, the Coop offered a good contract the union turned it down, the 1300 employee’s pay with their livelihoods. Happy Thanksgiving.
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Three “dislikes” so far, and yet no evidence of the alleged rejected appeal. Interesting. Why are the *dislikers* “disliking” instead of helping us all get to the bottom of this? You either have Riskey on your speed-dial yourselves, or you know someone that does. Step up to the plate and ask him to provide proof for what he said.
Or just continue to “dislike” and hope that yet another union-perpetuated myth gets circulated….no matter how inaccurate or untrue it happens to be.
24 hours and counting…
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Jeff…union..welfare…just ask them
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When this whole thing started, I immediately sympathized with the workers. I believe strongly in the working man getting a fair deal and feel it is important for them to have decent wages.
However the more I learned the more my opinion turned. I have read much about the offer given to them and now have absolutely no sympathy for them. I work at a health insurance company and I don’t even get free coverage anymore. Almost nobody does, that’s the price to pay for health care costs that have spiraled out of control. I don’t have any sort of protections with seniority or from outsourcing, I have to continually earn my place and prove myself. My benefits have been reduced for several years now at a rate that exceeds my pay raises, which has resulted in net income loss. Does it irritate me? Of course it does. But I also understand that American companies need to compete with the rest of the world if they want to continue to exist at all. That’s the sobering reality that can’t be ignored.
These workers need to wake up and look around. The contract offer was more than fair and brought them in line with the rest of the working word in a tough economy.
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Locked out workers argue that their health insurance was negotiated long ago, at the expense of wage increases so it shouldn’t be negotiable. They’ve said the proposed increases are partially makeup for past concessions, so this offer is an insult. Good points, except that the world is upside down since their last negotiations. Even with the salary increases, I think the company offer was employees going backwards some. I still think their vote opposing ACS’s offer was misguided. Also, I can see why people dislike Jeff H (someone with a paycheck and strong union opinion), but why is there such hate for these locked-out workers? These individuals are as important and decent as any of us. With the holiday season upon us, I’m asking everyone to take a kinder, more understanding approach.
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Alvin: i don’t believe it is hate for the union employees, but rather total disgust for their behavior. They go on TV and to the newspapers with their sob stories; they go after Dave Bergs seat on the board for the United Way; and it goes on and on…this was NOT something the company did to them…their vote is keeping them out of work. I do not hate any of them, some of them are my good friends; but I cannot condone their behavior…it sounds like they will all be full of turkey…remember some of us are also locked out because of their vote….and who in the workforce has not gone backwards some with healthcare…enough is enough…. and if they don’t like what Crystal is offering; get on with life and let the rest of us go back to work…
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It isn’t hate. I have relatives locked-out. Rather, it is pity. The workers are being led around by the union bosses. They are being played like a fiddle.
There was an editorial in the Fargo Forum back in Aug/Sep about how this was a case of corporate greed. They interviewed the author on talk radio (a show with strong pro-union views) and let callers ask questions. Question was “What is it in the contract you don’t like?” The author’s response…. well I haven’t really read it or looked into the details.
So she was motivated to write a column about “corporate greed”, but not motivated to study what the company was offering.
The second vote…. the union puts up for a vote a non-negotiated contract (ACSC offer) and they whip the members into a fury becuase there was no negotiated back-to-work agreement.
The union still seems to believe their best strategy is to not negotiate. I read this last weekend that they believe public opinion is turning in their favor. They think they will start to get unemployement $$ soon.
I think it has gotten to the point where they only talk to and listen to other locked-out workers. I don’t know how this thing now ends. I’m afraid there is much more suffering that will have to occur first.
The offered contracts results in a small but positive yearly increase 1.6% (high health care costs) to 2.7% (low health care costs). The language on job security has been strengthened twice by ACSC. I don’t see ACSC giving up on the changes to seniority rules.
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The union workers can think for themselves….so you cannot blame the “union bosses” for this. Apparently the employees had the chance to vote to accept the contract or turn it down. They voted and decided not to not accept the contract.
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kassie: you speak volumes, but how could you be in such a minority. I guess there’s been anger and disgust displayed towards both sides of this issue. It sure can come across as hateful. My input, before the last landslide vote, was attempting to convince employees to take the offer. It’s kind of lame to think that people’s views change because of something we post here. I feel bad for your situation, but I feel bad for the 90% who opposed the latest ACS offer, which seems very close to their first (and final) offer. In these uncertain times, it didn’t look like a union-busting thing, it looked like a company making their last best effort. The company would have been surprised with a 51-49 vote, but were stunned by the original 96% rejection.
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Wonder how much Dayton was paid to give such a completely biased opinion of the situation.
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Alvin; First let me give you examples of why I quit the union..#1.. a few years ago there was a mass spill in the CVP room…2 supervisors picked up hoses and were hosing the mass down before it hardened; as they were doing this a union steward walked by and immediatly went up and filed a complaint because they were doing union work; the mass hardened and we spent 2 weeks chopping the hardened mass with pickaxes and hauling it out…really whom were they protecting; not one of the union uppers were down there helping clean it up .This happens all the time, management is not allowed by the union to help us …..#2… Year round employees have S&A…this is a benefit payed for completely by Crystal…if an employee is sick or has an accident the company pays 80% of your wage for up to 6 months. We have employees who have abused this program….the local union presidents live in girlfriend works only enough time each year to qualify and then goes out on S&A for 6 months each and every year…this program has helped out many employees with legitimate iilnesses but because of the abuses which the union fights for the company has lowered this benefit to 60%…does this upset me…yes it does…#3..job security…the union says that is their biggest problem…lets look at that..the union claims the language puts jobs in jeopardy…. Crystal has been subcontracting for years; with the shorter inter-campaigns the employees do not have time to get everything ready for the new campaign…nothing different here except that Crystal wants to lower the days before they can do the subcontracting…they have also sent a letter to Steve Bertelli regional vice President of the BCTGM which says they “specifically guarantee that no union employee or position will be eliminated due to subcontracting” dated Sept 2, 2011…this is not good enough for the union…can’t do much more than that can they…The union then says it is not about the money….PLEASE someone; be specific on what the heck it is then…Do i feel bad for union employees…NO….is there anger ..YES…What they want is your support and sympathy…they do not get mine …Have a wonderful Thanksgiving everyone!!!!!
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You deserve to be angry. Few people know less about this subject than me, but I wish you could get back to work. I hope it happens soon. There doesn’t seem to be much of a chance, though. I’m afraid the last union vote put you in a very long-term limbo.
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Kassie~ can the nonunion employees apply for the jobs? That would leave just leave the 174 members that were allowed to vote right?
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Starbuck; for a nonunion employee to apply for one of the open hire positions they would have to quit; because we are covered under the master agreement …we then could apply…In doing that we would lose our vesting….
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It’s no surpise that Dayton sides with the union. According to MPR, unions contributed over $2.2 million to both his election campaign and the recount effort.
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Exactly Margaret. Shar Knutson the president of the AFL-CIO stated in a letter to the editor that much of what Dayton is saying.
More Kool aid anyone?!?!
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We give thanks to senior Berg for our jobs and our new life with good people gracias!
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Happy Thanksgiving to everyone. I hope you have a safe and happy day with friends, family, and loved ones (I’m working so that will be a big NOT for me). On the labor front, my son has a pre-employment training session with ACS next week. I hope he gets it.
The trouble is it is only temporary. If he quits where he is now and they settle in a week, he is SOL. Don’t you hate having to make choices without enough information?
I told him to just make sure and leave where he is on good terms so he can go back.
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flying nurse; There is a lot of uncertainty here…I wish your son a lot of luck…I hope he likes his employment with Crystal…Because of all the employees that have quit or retired I am almost sure he will have a long employment with Crystal…Best of luck to him and it will be fun to hear how he feels about his experience with Crystal. I hope it as good as mine was.
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I hope someday to meat your son senior flying nurse. My amigos and I work at the Crookston plant and 7 of us rent a aapartment y vamos there. We also church at a hispánica mission in there. People treat us with respect for helping out. We feel welcomed sentimos dados la bienvenida
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He is applying for the EGF factory but Crookston is close enough to be feasible.
By the way Enrique his stepmother is MX. He is not fluent, but he is getting better. We have covered the basics: Taco Bell is to real MX food as Panda Buffet is to real Chinese food, homemade tortillas are worth killing or dying for, and the best way to choose a Mexican restaurant is to look for the place where you have to point at the menu because no one speaks English.
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I don’t understand why it’s such a big deal. The company made their offer. It has been deemed “fair” by the NLRB. The union doesn’t like it. The union needs to move on then. Pretty simple. Let those that want to work work!!! End of story.
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Quote Gayle Lund:.
“As a locked-out American Crystal Sugar employee, I can tell Herald readers that every one of us wants the lockout to end soon.
I urge all growers to talk to their board members about going back to the bargaining table. If the company offers us a reasonable health insurance plan and leaves seniority issues as they have been in the past, this standoff will end. It’s that simple.
This dispute never has been about wages. Our union members have accepted below cost-of-living raises for many years in order that we keep the health insurance plan we have had in the past. Should we really be expected to go backward after working to get growers a record payment for their crop?”
17% raise, and pay less for health insurance then 99% of your neighbors, how is that going backwards?
As for the seniority? It has never been a problem to the employee that shows up on time and does his or her job.
She starts out her letter saying “I urge all growers to talk to their board members about going back to the bargaining table. If the company offers us a reasonable health insurance plan and leaves seniority issues as they have been in the past, this standoff will end. It’s that simple.”
This is simple as well. You lost the support of growers when you start calling them millionaire welfare farmers.
You have run your management through the mud, and questioned their integrity.
You people have bitten the hand that feeds you, now live with your choices. The growers will as well.
Please if I am wrong have Mr. Froemke, or Mr. Riskey post something other then places to send money, and sob story letters to the editor on their website. I for one would love to hear their reasoning for holding out this long. I have found nothing to date to tell me what is wrong with the contract other then opinions.
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Scole: I read the editorial, and guess what? I threw up in my mouth again. Just give us what we want and we will go back to work. Every time I read one of these pieces I swear I will never buy Crystal again if they cave. Not because I wrote an editorial on the evils of the seniority system, I just can’t stand their insufferable attitude.
That is sad and I am sure I will pay for it later, but it is the truth.
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Well, scole, you are a bit wrong, but I think it’s mostly because of your hateful manner. Union employees will lose ground, even with the seemingly big hourly rate increases. That’s what the cost of healthcare has done, skewed everything. Thanks toletters from a couple of locked out employees, I am sure of the biggest issue, HEALTHCARE COSTS. I KNEW it. ACS employees are likely going to have to suck it up and pay 17% of their family health costs. By any measure, that is going backwards. I just wish the union leaders could look at today’s world. 83% premium covered by the employer is a step backwards, but everyone is being held hostage by our healthcare system, not health ins., healthcare. Union employees..please reconsider and vote in favor of ASC’s last, best offer.
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Alvin; The biggest reason employees will go backwards is because they overestimated their own worth and thought Crystal could not process without them….The increase in healthcare is small in comparison to what they have lost in wages….The wages I have lost alone could have paid for at least 8 years of deductible…that doesn’t count prescriptions…and the union says it is not about the money…have they changed their minds again…I certainly do not think scole was being hateful. What makes you say that?
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kassie: you are right. I re-read a bunch of these comments and confused scole’s with a couple of other comments. I’m still stuck on my original thought. No employee wants to negotiate away employee benefits, but it’s happening to virtually everyone. I feel so bad that the union didn’t see it before overwhelmingly rejecting a second opportunity to go back to work. My other focus has been the disgusting increases in healthcare costs. It’s an entitled industry and no one seems to want to hold them accountable.
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..and if flyingnurse doesn’t do something about that acid reflux, I’m going to start mentioning every time i crap my pants.
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Amen Alvin. I am taking my Prilosec & avoiding too many idiotic editorials.
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Alvin; sorry about your pants problem…..but that is one thing we can fix…right?
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The locked out workers deserve one thing from ACS for Christmas this year – a lump of Ardoch coal.
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DECERTIFY THE UNION. Petition the NLRB and they will sanction the vote themselves-simple.
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I think that is a great idea; but I don’t see them decertifying yet…..and I do think it needs to be a sanctioned vote….I would think the union would also want this because then no one could question the results
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Scooter: You obviously have not read the contract, nor have you read the language that has been modified to ensure their jobs….And how is this working for the union employees?….you probably won’t have an income or at least not the income you are used to for a long time…..in my thinking we will never make up what we have lost already…now we can cut off our nose to spite our face or we can move on to other jobs….obviously Crystal is paying you better or you wouldn’t care.
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Ask yourself this: will I ever recoup any of the income lost since the lockout began? The answer is NO. Health insurance is a sore subject with anybody working in the US. My insurance premium was paid by my employer up till 3 years ago. Since then it has creeped up to $100 a month with a HIGH deductable HSA. I understand having a 3-5 year contract you can get insulated from what’s happening with health insurance and the economy. If you have a marketable skill, look what that skill is getting wages and benefits in your area. You are right Scooter, step back and re-evaluate the situation.
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Gussy: You are 100% correct. I am a nurse for Pete’s sake. Do I get a discount? “Professional Courtesy?” Negative. I pay $200 EVERY TWO WEEKS for an insurance policy that covers a fraction what it used to. LIke you I went from $50 every two weeks for a family plan that was really very good to $400 a month that doesn’t pay a dime till I have satisfied my $2500 family deductible.
Am I happy? Not really. Is anyone else offering any better? Nope.
Reality bites but it does not change because we do not like it.
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***“Should i sign a contract that will end up paying me less with no guarantee that i will keep my job once let back into the plant?”***
Paying you less than what? Less than what you want? Perhaps. Less than what the market indicates is fair? Hardly.
You can frame the question(s) you have in the manner you’ve already demonstrated the ability to do, (i.e. asking them in a *leading* manner), OR….you can ask them in an unbiased and non-leading way. When you ask them in a leading manner, you’re not really being honest with yourself. You don’t want an *honest* answer, you want the person answering to adopt your way of thinking.
Asking why you should “sign a contract that ends up paying you less” is just union rhetoric, and isn’t a question you have or something you’re confused about. Why? Because the framing of your question fails to mention/address a small detail that’s *kind of* important here:
When you say “less” you certainly don’t mean “less” than what the job market has determined AND demonstrated is deserved and/or fair. You only mean “less” than you WANT.
Imagine you were an employer, (if you can), for a minute. How do you determine what your employees’ wage scale will be? Do you toss the figures other area employers offer right out the window? No rhetoric, just answer the question.
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Scooter: Sorry to rain on your parade, but you do not have a job at the present time, and there is at least a 50/50 chance that without significant concessions by the union you will have one anytime during the next biennium.
As I have stated before, no one has a right to work, but everyone has the responsibility to work. Right now the members of the union who have not moved on are not meeting their responsibilities which is why they are steadily losing whatever support they once had.
My son is working very hard to take your job. It is not personal, he does not even know you exist, he just takes his responsibilities very seriously.
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Scooter; This is my livlihood here…I also have friends and family that are growers…they are my neighbors …I also have friends in management…I see both sides of this ….employees and managements….speaking as an employee I want this over but when you say “removed from their job because some “imported” exec takes a dump on someone” you really lose your validity….we lost our jobs because of the union vote…plain and simple.
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How’s that workin’ out for you? Cute. gussy nailed the issue. In my office, we’ve seen the same erosion of benefits while the employer is getting spanked harder than we are. No one likes less net pay, but some of the employees understand. Others walk around blaming George Bush and scowling at management, who, by the way, has had the exact same erosion. Virtually every non-union shop has gone backwards in these areas, including owners and management. It has nothing to do with what I believe.
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