November 9, 2010 at 6:00 pm in INFORUM
It’s curious that North Dakotans said “no” to a high-fence hunting ban during the fall hunting season. Continue Reading
Tags: Editorials, Election, high fence hunting, hunting, Opinion 39 Comments »
Lets be clear. The Humane society of the United States is NOT the Humane Society. The HSUS is a leftist animal rights organization that wishes to ban all hunting and all commercial raising of any type of livestock. The Humane Society does good work but it’s sad that these nut jobs have taken a name like theirs to purposefully confuse people about their agenda. The HSUS is against ranching, commercial fishing, animal research, any type of fur harvesting and believes animals should have the same legal rights as humans. They target our state because of the freedoms we enjoy and as we all know, libs love to tell others how to live their lives.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 53 16
Why is it you have to make everything into a liberal spin? News Flash! I would be termed a lib, I live in Cass, and I voted NO on this. Since you clearly need some help here, let me inform you that libs do not vote in lock-step to take away rights. but being a moron such as yourself, you will probably ignore this fact.
Hot debate. What do you think? 24 21
Viking has this right. The measure was concocted by HSUS to create some sort of a foothold in N.Dakota with which they could begin eroding all hunting and raising of livestock in N.D. It was written in a confusing manner on purpose; 1) To get it passed; 2) To give them enough grey area in the wording to legally begin challenging all livestock and animal operations in the state.
This was NEVER about high-fence hunting/shooting. It was ALWAYS about HSUS generating a creative means to activate in N.Dakota.
No sense debating what “true hunting” really should be. HSUS was only trying to create a wedge between N.Dakotans all along. Fortunately, we were all (mostly) smart enough to see through their scheme.
Thank goodness for farmers and ranchers all across N.Dakota for standing tough on this one.
Hot debate. What do you think? 25 11
Which of these http://www.humanesociety.org/issues/ implies HSUS wants to ban “all hunting and all commercial raising of any type of livestock”?
Like or Dislike: 4 7
Read this article:
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Viking, libs are all about equal rights for everyone. Including ranchers. I voted against passage of this.
Like or Dislike: 7 3
When the game can shoot back, then it’ll be a “fair” hunt. Until then it is all harvesting, inside a fence or outside doesn’t really matter.
Hot debate. What do you think? 40 42
“When the game can shoot back, then itâ€™ll be a â€œfairâ€ hunt. Until then it is all harvesting, inside a fence or outside doesnâ€™t really matter.”
What percentage of human hunters would have to be killed by deer in order for you to consider it fair? 50%?
I’m just curious.
Hot debate. What do you think? 21 11
Agree with raven, but in all fairness, I think the deer act like suicide bombers they are continually jumping in front of cars killing themselves and motorists. Maybe we should have the deer put on the terrorist watch list.
Like or Dislike: 14 4
LMAO! Damn terrorist deer!!
I say take away the guns for the hunt. climb a tree and wait for them with a knife
Like or Dislike: 9 1
I agree wholeheartedly with the article. There must be strictly regulated controls for the business of high fence shooting. Disease control is most important and therefore state inspection of the privately owned herds is imperitive.
Hot debate. What do you think? 24 11
Let me add that if these controls aren’t in place now maybe some good could come out of this vote by getting them in place now.
Like or Dislike: 18 10
While I am against high fence hunting or (canned hunts) I do not feel we need another stupid law regulating the peoples rights. If someone has property and is a law abiding citizen he should be left alone to do what is legal and ethical on his own as we should not have to pass laws to limit what he can do within reason of course. All animals were wild before they were tamed. I also am concerned about disease from these animals and hope that they are tested.
I agree with Viking on his post.
It is no different than gun control or anything else. They want a little bit every so often then in the end they have the whole pie. One has to be very careful on passing laws limiting anything or pretty soon we are taken over from within!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 36 9
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This measure effects such a small fraction of hunting in North Dakota. It’s about businesses that have profited from using high fence hunting. Ask any local hunter whether they would hunt like this and very, very few would say yes. This is not about property, this is about fair sporting. You have every right to do what you want on your land, but if you hunt you need to play fair.
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 15 26
So jj, how many acres do you cover when hunting? Did you know that almost all the high fence sites in ND cover 600-2000 acres? I doubt you walk that much in a day. Just fyi, 600 acres is just under 1 square mile. Now think about that. It might sound small but a hunter walking draws and tree rows is only going to see a few hundred feet at a time. even if we put it at 500 feet to the left and right, it would take 6 passes to visually cover the whole square mile, that would be a six mile walk.
Besides, “when you hunt, you need to play fair.”? Does a deer have a rifle or a bow? Do they mask their scent? No, so really, your play fair comment is kinda dumb.
Hot debate. What do you think? 23 10
â€˜If You Havenâ€™t Hunted Man, You Havenâ€™t Huntedâ€™
“And I’ll just tell you this: Until you’ve hunted man, you haven’t hunted yet,” Ventura told Anderson. “Because you need to hunt something that can shoot back at you to really classify yourself as a hunter. You need to understand the feeling of what it’s like to go into the field and know your opposition can take you out. Not just go out there and shoot Bambi.”
Like or Dislike: 13 10
Why is this being brought up again? These operations are HIGHLY regulated by the state. If these 12 facilities would have been shut down, how would this have prevented any disease issues as there are 100 facilities total. Should we now get rid of all cattle if they pose any disease threats to wildlife? I personally believe if we are going to get CWD in our state’s wildlife it will walk in, as it already has.
Like or Dislike: 18 6
And lastly, almost 500,000 was spent between the opposition and the proponents. Isn’t there something better that this money could have been spent on! Isn’t there something more important in our lives that need addressing like starving children, homeless people, rather than deciding if someone killing their privately owned animal that is already raised for food is illegal?
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 24 6
More than one ND voter told me that this question on the ballot was written in such a confusing manner that they weren’t sure which way to vote – whether they were either for or against the measure. One person even said they wanted to vote against it and asked an election judge on site which way to do that. They instructed him in the reverse of what he actually should have done. So, a couple thoughts:
1)Measures on ballots should be required to be written in black & white so they are very clear and understandable. Many times, creative writing is utilized to influence a positive vote when a voter intends to vote against a measure.
2)…….and this is the MOST important. VOTERS: if you aren’t SURE of what you’re voting for or against, or haven’t had an opportunity to study up and inform yourself about ANYTHING on a ballot – PLEASE SKIP IT and don’t vote on that particular thing. Whether it’s for a candidate or a measure, you can do more harm than good by voting when you aren’t CERTAIN about what you’re approving. IT IS OKAY TO LEAVE A BLANK ON A BALLOT and only vote on what you know you’re voting for/against.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 20 4
I agree with you that the measures on ballots should be CLEAR and UNDERSTANDABLE. This is not the first time that a measure has required a backwards type of vote to get it voted down. Many of them over the years have been worded this way.
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Full agreement with you. Many people did not understand this measure on the ballot. And as stated, this is not the first time a ballot was poorly written.
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If the wording was confusing, you should complain to the Sec of State, Al Jaeger. He is supposed to advise and approve petitions. Not saying he can absolutely force a wording change but he certainly can pressure them.
That is a good idea. While I did not have difficulty understanding this one, the ballots should be plainly written.
Like or Dislike: 8 0
Viking you are right about the Humane Society of the United States. I think a lot of people donate to this organization thinking they are helping their local Humane Society. If you wish to donate you should donate directly to your local Humane Society. It’s not only liberals who back the national society.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 18 3
I think we need to channel our resources into making sure all “fair chase” hunters are behaving in a legal and ethical manner. It’s the yahoos who break the rules and disrespect landowners and the very animals they chase who give the REAL sportsmen a bad name. MUCH more so than the handful of HFH operations in the state.
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I agree, Barb. If I had a nickel for every hunter I saw violating hunting laws, I’d be a rich man!
Like or Dislike: 11 5
Barb you are right. I just read your post and just the other day was talking with a fellow land owner and we both commented about all the garbage that we saw and picked up since opening of deer season in our area. We both said how we didn’t know at least 95 percent of the people hunting in our area. My family personally picked up over a half of a pickup box of garbage that people threw out on the gravel and prairie roads. If they want more land posted then keep throwing it out and keep breaking the hunting laws and more land will get posted. My neighbor farms over 5,000 acres and he is going to post it all next year because of the lack of respect that is shown to his land. People are driving off trail, shooting on posted land, not asking landowners for permission to go on posted land, not looking to see what is beyond what they are shooting at. Bullets literally fly through our farm yard every year during deer season. This is crazy and people had better start being more careful. It isn’t just the young hunters either there are plenty of older people doing it also. We also have seen people driving off trail on WMA lands don’t they read?
Just my thoughts as a few will wreck it for all!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 20 1
I’d love to ask one or several of any of the dozens of large farm farmers in and around my town if I could hunt their property, but frankly I would feel dumb about doing it.
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If you’re against hunting in a game farm or “high fenced” area, then don’t patronize one. Nobody is forcing you to. If you have an opinion on what others do, that’s fine, but to say “ban it” because YOU don’t like it, is not appropriate.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 22 5
Since the concern seems to be the entire state ending up like Texas where the only way to “hunt” is to pay a games ranch there are things that could be done to pass a referendum. First when you write the law grandfather in the existing canned hunt opperations. That way it protects the investment they have made. But also do not let them refer to what they sell as hunting, a hunting license is not required to shoot these tame animals, and there is no “season”. Do not let any new canned hunt businesses to open. If they want to raise tame Elk Or Deer fine just stop any new people from selling the canned hunts.
As for the land owners who are angry at the mess. It is a very small minority of people who commit these acts. They are not hunters they are criminals and should be treated as such. I believe increasing the use and length of loss of hunting and fishing privledges would have a positive effect of removing these people from the field. example: hunting on posted land first offence loss of privleges for the current year and the next. A second violation in 10 years loss of privleges for 10 years. That would remove those violators that make us hunters look bad, cause some land owners to not allow hunting, and leave trash all over. Not all the trash comes from hunters. I have found the worst violators are often local new hunters. Often they are the children of the land owners who think they can go anywhere and often rip up dirt section roads with their 4×4 pickups mud running. I for one dont use these roads unless it is dry or the roads frozen. There are very few farmers I have found that are just mean and nasty without cause. If show respect most respond the same way. I dont mind a farmer turning down my request to hunt but it does make farmers look bad when they respond in ways they often accuse hunters of. If there is no name or phone number on the posting sign I just assume the farmer does not want to be bothered and leave them alone, it can get irritating to constantly have your work interrupted.
Also if you are a hunter and see a violation report it to the authorities right away. If we police ourselves better we can reduce the number of outlaw slob hunters to the good of all.
Like or Dislike: 4 3
Glen, they’re not tame animals. The premise you base your argument on is incorrect. Are you sure you know what you’re talking about? Have you ever watched Reel Shot Outdoors or Hank Parker 3D? Do those deer look tame to you?
Like or Dislike: 4 4
I have seen these animals myself on some of these farms in the state. They had no fear of humans. They did not let you just walk up to them but had no reaction up to 50 yards or so. And no I have never hunted them.
Dan I do agree that right now there is little concern. But 70 years ago in Texas they would have said the exact same thing!
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Well Glen, that’s certainly not what I’ve seen. I certainly wouldn’t assume they’re all pet cats with antlers and hooves just because you’ve seen some that are.
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I don’t think that should be a concern, as these ranches have been in existence in our state for 20 plus years and the numbers have remained constant. Texas is entirely different, as they do not have the public land that we have, and they were allowed to fence in publicly owned wildlife. The game farms here are only privately owned animals.
Like or Dislike: 6 3
Glen, I applaud you for the way you hunt and drive. Our roads get tore up when it is wet and with the 12 inches of snow we had before deer season everything is wet. As far as the prairie roads go we have to fix them ourselves when they get holes or anything else happens to them. That is what is so darn disturbing as we see people flying through the mud and water and this just makes a bigger hole. All they have to do is slow down and try and straddle it or go around it that is pretty simple but some of these supposedly hunters must have half a brain if that. My whole family hunts and we were brought up to honor someones land and roads as if they were your own. We also are having problems with people spot lighting at night either with a spot light or their headlights. Yes, headlights can not be used to look at game at night. Many people don’t know this and some are such great hunters they shoot at them at night also. Chased one vehicle this weekend that was doing it and had law enforcement out and the game warden but we didn’t catch them this time. I know it is a few but like most things many will suffer from it.
For you people in the city think how you would like it if someone keeps throwing trash in your yard and drives on it and tears it up. This is what we put up with every year and it keeps getting worse. I have many people from the city who come out here and hunt and they know the rules and obey them.
One thought if you do get some game on someones land stop and say thank you and even offer them something. Most won’t take anything but a thank you goes a long long way! We used to hunt in the badlands on some ranches and went out every year and helped with the cattle or fixing fences. The ranchers really appreciated it and we did too. Just be friendly and it will open many doors.
Good luck to all and hope your freezers get full of meat!
Like or Dislike: 12 0
Hunting is great! but if you need to shoot animals that are fenced in and can’tget away you aren’t a hunter, you’re a loser.
Like or Dislike: 6 5
Tell that to the child with a dying wish or disabled vets that utilize these places. Or how about the 80 year old man.
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Dan every one of those people you mentioned can be accomidated by Game and Fish so they can have a real hunt not a canned one. The DAV that I know do not want to be pandered to and treated like they need some set up hunt. They just want an opportunity to hunt for real.
Like or Dislike: 2 6
And how will that happen when people would have to wait for a once in a lifetime tag? Obviously you don’t know the same DAV that have used these facilities that I do. These facilities offer charity hunts through Hunt of a Lifetime and Hunts for Heroes. And who is to say that a “real” hunt can’t happen on these facilities? Some of them are pretty large.
Like or Dislike: 3 1
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