by Duluth News Tribune
July 15, 2010 at 7:00 pm in Duluth News Tribune
While receiving financial assistance amounting to almost $20,000, a Duluth couple hid an inheritance with which they went on a spending spree. Continue Reading
Tags: Crime 112 Comments »
Everything that is wrong with America today in one article!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 102 4
Now if only the county/state/whoever would start investigating the majority of the rest of the people on welfare. Please don’t think that I am saying everyone on assistance doesn’t need it, but I AM saying if you’ve got the latest gaming system, Iphone, largest TV possible, name brand clothes and you’re getting assistance for food, daycare and rent, there’s something wrong with that picture and it needs to be brought to light.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 108 4
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While I think that’s true that there’s abuse in some cases, there are times when things may appear different than the reality.
I’ve seen many families that have a lot of ‘stuff’ but, it’s from those rent-to-own places.
Brand name clothing etc can usually be bought pretty cheap on eBay too. You also have to take into account that some things may have been gifts from other family members.
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 29 89
I do not agree with you – I have seen way too much abuse on the welfare system. Including an acquaintance who had her second child prior to getting married so they wouldn’t have to pay for the birth. And it’s always great to see someone use their EBT card to buy 2 carts full of groceries and then watch them drive away in their brand new SUV. Not buying it!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 65 11
I’m not saying there isn’t abuse. There definitely IS but, things may not always be as they appear.
I just wish people weren’t so quick to judge and always so ready to believe the worst.
Hey, at least those people were using their EBT card for food…not everyone that has one does, ya know?
Do you know if the vehicle was actually theirs?
Just remember, lots of people at one time had good jobs and when the economy tanked, they lost them. That could mean that while they were working and could afford it, they bought nice things. When they ended up unemployed, they qualified for Food Support.
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 28 50
Buying from those rent to own places costs twice as much as anywhere else. So how does that work? If you really believe your posts I have some land to sell you.
Like or Dislike: 9 4
It works cuz they can afford the small monthly payments over a long period of time rather than having to come up with a lump sum all at once.
Like or Dislike: 4 12
Many things come to mind with this article. What goes around comes around is foremost in my mind. Where there’s smoke there’s fire is another.
Verification rules for public assistance have become way too lax imho. I don’t know how This One came to the attention of Social Services but thank the heavens it did.
I feel terrible for the five children in this home. It appears the parents are now split up? The mother deserves a Lot More than a simple slap on the wrist (and the father as well) but what will happen with the Children? Will the county end up spending more to care for the children if the parents go to jail? There doesn’t appear to be a responsible member in the family from what has been reported, but who knows?
One more family now caught up in the revolving doors of the court system and welfare system practicing 4 of the 7 deadly sins…..pride, sloth, greed and envy and you might include gluttony for the excessive need for material possessions.
Yes, Jason, Everything that is Wrong in America today in one article AND Two Generations of one family when you take into consideration the mother and brother of Teri as well.
Familiarity with this family doth breed contempt. Thank you for bringing this to our attention DNT.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 67 8
This is clearly an extreme case of abuse of the system. I agree with Misty in that I worry about the effect this has on the poor kids. AA’s comment about investigating “the majority” of the rest of recipients struck me with a bit of a sour note though. The system worked here. They were found out. The county does it’s job. As far as the “majority” of the rest of them needing investigation, I can only add that I have known several honest, decent, and very caring recipients from years past. They were in a rough stretch of their lives, bettered themselves as best they could, no longer need or use the assistance, and are now very productive members of our community. Sure, there will always be someone out there scamming the system, be it in assistance or in business, banking, or government. Hopefully those few get their just rewards.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 50 13
Sour note or not John, the fact is it’s happening ALOT more than we see. I have one friend who repeatedly tells me she refuses work full time (even though she is more than capable physically and mentally AND has a family that’s more than willing to watch her kid while she is at work) because she doesn’t want to lose her assistance. She gets mad at me when I constantly tell her I can’t go out to bars or to eat with her because I don’t have any money because I’m paying all my own bills and after those I only have enough for bread and peanut butter and gas to get to work. Am I jealous? Heck no, I’m more than proud to say I’m an independent woman. But I do NOT like the fact that these people are living off my hard earned dollars!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 78 9
I have worked with welfare Mothers, Fathers, families for 0ver 36 years. This article makes the front page, however, there are young and elderly residing under bridges, in cars, as they have fell through cracks. In my experience I have been livid with people who move to this part of the country and are on every program. They can tell you which food shelves to go to and on what day. (they also get food stamps) They get free rent, health care, dental assistance, glasses and sometimes cars. In my opinion, the counties should hire several fraud investigators. I have compassion for those who are in need, get help and become productive. However, the people in this article should be in prison…but prison will enable them to still taken are. I am angry when I where all the taxes I pay wasted. This is a complicated subject. I believe the women mentioned in the article also did her “work” in douglas County.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 58 3
The thing is, as “extreme” as this sounds, this is nothing in the overall scheme of things. The amount of fraud and waste that occurs within the welfare system is truly, truly disgusting.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 56 4
I wonder if the county will be able to confiscate all of those vehicles and sell them in order to recoup some of their money.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 52 4
Is what they have done all that different from what many other welfare people do? Unfortunately, they make it their way of life, and this comes at the expense of the taxpayer. Maybe if they went after 4 or 5 $10,000-level cheats, and the riff-raff from Chicago here to collect a check, they would figure out just how widespread this problem is.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 40 11
at least one investigator was doing their job kudo to them. Now lets be just as vigilant on the rest of the crooks who are using the system illegaly
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 19 3
Personally, I say cut the welfare payments to the amount of the lowest paying state in the country. We’ll see how many people are here to live and work and how many are here to just collect a welfare check. I will also lay odds that the crime and drug problems will drop in this town also.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 38 11
That’s something that really doesn’t make a lot of sense. Just why isn’t the amount of welfare benefits handed out the same, no matter the state?
Are some states trying to attract more GA recipients to boost the federal subsidy?
Hot debate. What do you think? 15 16
The Lauers truly sound like people I would prefer not to associate with.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 23 3
This is totally a “Hope I don’t get caught” scenerio – Too bad, looks like you did!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 28 2
Speaking of Welfare….thought this interactive map of where people are moving to….and from was kind of interesting. Check it out…
Like or Dislike: 7 9
This is why all welfare should be administered at the most local level. Locals know what’s going on and can put a stop to abuse. Federal Bureaucrats haven’t a clue and couldn’t care less. State bureaucrats aren’t much better. Eliminate all the Federal welfare programs and the local units would be awash with money that could be used for people that most need help.
Like or Dislike: 13 7
a.a. @ 9:39 a.m.
Totally Agree. I think we All know of someone who has cheated and scammed Public Aid of some type. I also know a ‘young’ woman who lied on an application for First Time Home Buyers. The wedding was planned and she actually TOOK OFF her Engagement Ring for the Home Interview to PASS!!!! You had to be ‘Single’ and it was a long, long time ago. She was actually a County Employee when she did this. When I spoke out about it I was ostracized. Sometimes I feel like an idiot for following the rules, but I sleep well at night;)
There is a Phone Number listed you can call to report welfare fraud in the county government pages of the phone book. We should all participate in providing information to the county about these Scammers and Liars. jmho
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 22 6
I think as far as home purchases and things of that nature go, there’s only 2 options for marital status…married or single. Engaged doesn’t really count.
If she was not yet married….she was single.
Like or Dislike: 16 11
read the terms and conditions of a first time homebuyers and a fixed rate mortgage. the fixed rate is way better, except you need some money down. the only advantage of a first time home buyers is the no or low money down. and sometimes that money down that they “give” you is in the fees and closing costs. I spent the extra time to get amortization schedules and analyzed the total cost of buying a house, comparing several kinds of loans. the best is the traditional fixed rate mortgage with 20% down. No mortgage insurance premium, and a much lower final cost after the 20 years. first time home buyers is a big lie.
Like or Dislike: 4 9
When I worked in a collection agency, it never ceased to amaze me the number of people who “couldn’t afford” to pay what they racked up, yet wouldn’t give up their high speed internet or fancy cell phones, etc., while I’m on the other end making $6/hour trying to get them to pay their bill and I couldn’t afford those things myself. No matter how low my income has gone, I always paid my bills first, never falling behind (knock on wood). Seems to me this is a societal problem where people in general think they are entitled to these things foregoing personal responsibilities in order to keep them.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 30 7
How do YOU know they had a fancy cell phone or high speed internet? You have no way of knowing that information as a collector.
Like or Dislike: 5 6
She knew because she was probably trying to collect their payments for those services.
They are the same losers whose phones are shut off month after month and they think they’re the world’s best customer when they finally pay their bill.
Like or Dislike: 5 3
OMG, these people disgust me. There are people that legitimately need help and can’t get it, while people like these two are sucking it up and flaunting it too.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 30 2
I agree completely, Rieka. There are people out there who have lost their jobs, and Congress is screwing around with extending unemployment benefits. There are people who have worked hard all their lives and are struggling just to put food on the table under this economic disaster we are forced to live with.
Thanks a lot, Barack!
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 19 34
Pitney, I agreed with you until you got to the last line. This economic mess is not of Obama’s doing. Recall that the first stimulus package was passed while Bush was still in office. The deregulation of the financial industry during the Bush years are the root cause of our current financial woes. I think Obama has done an admirable job of cleaning up the mess he inherited. Yes, we aren’t out of the woods yet but are headed in the right direction at least
Hot debate. What do you think? 33 19
Deregulation of the financial industry took place PRIOR to Bush’s term, in 1999…look up the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act . It also appears to be a largely bi-partisan supported measure too, as referenced by the roll call for that measure.. It would also helpful to be honest, alarms where being sounded about freddie and fanny back in 2004, and Democrats stated before congress that they didn’t see any reason to fix what was running just fine. It was running alright..right off the cliff.
Hot debate. What do you think? 12 21
I seem to remember the country having no debt and having a huge surplus when Clinton was in offfice…along with low unemployment and low interest. But people wanted him out caused he had a little fun in the office.
Hot debate. What do you think? 22 14
Clinton’s budget surplus was creative accounting, Washington doublespeak and smoke and mirrors.
The last year in history that any money was used to pay down the national debt was 1951.
You really can’t have a surplus…as it would have to be used to pay down the national debt…which didn’t go down at all any of those years that Clinton Administration and their supporters claim.
Since Government is governed by it’s own laws that they must use every dollar they collect, there is no such thing as a surplus, essentially, this country will never be debt free, or run with a positive cash balance.
People act like Bush was handed a positive checkbook balance, when reality is, legally, if there had be a true surplus, they are bound by law to use it to pay down existing debt.
“In the late 1990s, the government was running what it — and a largely unquestioning Washington press corps — called budget “surpluses.” But the national debt still increased in every single one of those years because the government was borrowing money to create the “surpluses.”
Hot debate. What do you think? 13 17
Haven’t unemployment benefits been extended more then once?
Like or Dislike: 7 5
There is a huge difference between no debt and a budget surplus. Bush did indeed inherit a budget surplus, we still had a national debt. Bush put us in deep doo-do when he borrowed from China to finance his oil war.
Like or Dislike: 14 7
Let’s not forget, that when we compare budgets, GW Bush did not include costs of two wars or Medicare, whereas Obama has included them. Something like only 2% of the deficit is attributed directly to Obama’s new spending. The rest is paying for prior obligations from Dubya.
“Facts are stupid things”
Like or Dislike: 15 12
That’s peanuts compared to the messiah’s deficits.
Like or Dislike: 6 12
Do some people actually need welfare? I’m sure… but I would love to see the actual numbers. I have a cousin who has 3 kids: all from different fathers. She receives over 1k/month in child support and sits on her rear end all day while getting almost 700/mon in food stamps, housing for her 1400 sq ft 3 bed apt, and free health insurance. And NO joking when I say this, she takes that 1000 and literally goes out EVERY single weekend. Her babysitter who also happens to be another family member of ours gets on average $100 to spend the whole weekend so she can come and go as she pleases. Must be nice!!
How does that story not scream out to people that you can live your life and be a lazy p.o.s. mother and get everything handed to you. What a joke! And before you say “oh well if social services knew…” yes, they do know. In fact, she got a DUI one of those weekends she was free of motherly duties and got busted with pot, housing found out and told her not to do it again!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 31 8
I fully support what they did. Inheritance should never be taxed, that is what is wrong with America today.
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 6 45
benefits are based on ability to pay. definitely must include assets, like cars, home, cash and investments. Or else all of us would be collecting benefits and that is called socialism.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 19 4
This has nothing to do with paying taxes on the money or not.
This couple hide the fact that they’d come in to a large sum of money so that they could spend it in BS stuff like fancy vechicles and still have the government pay their living expenses via welfare.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 21 2
Nobody is taxing the inheritance. They are simply saying that since you’ve got $400K, you don’t need, nor do you qualify for welfare.
Like or Dislike: 12 2
Moron. You support defrauding the welfare system because you’re against the death tax? I’m against the death tax too but it doesn’t mean I get to have welfare in lieu of a big inheritance. People are stupid.
Like or Dislike: 4 3
The St. Louis County Social Services Dept. needs a complete overhaul! Its become a total joke handout for anyone who wants to take the Greyhound up here.
1. Anyone applying should be required to show proof of a min. 2 yrs residency in the county to apply. Also in that time you have show at least xx amount of months employment.
2. All applicants should have their hand prints scanned and put into a state database so they can’t double dip like some are doing. And yes this is happening right here in SLC! Some may say this would cost a lot of money but how much will it save in the long run?
3. No child born to a welfare couple should be covered, this would stop them from having another to stay on the roll or get a larger check.
As for these 2? I hope a judge has the smarts to not let them use the kids as shields, and give them the max sentence. What will these kids learn if their parents get away with it? That they can also do it?
I say bring back the “WPA” and make them work for a dollar picking up trash and cleaning up the county instead of making it look trashy!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 29 5
if you follow similar stories, the mother gets off most of the time to care for the children, the dad gets anywhere from a slap on the wrist to some time in the iron bar motel. Restitution is usually a part of it. the same happens to drug problems, where both mom and dad are using and get caught. there is no easy solution for the kids sake. the ideal answer would be personal responsibility. That would take a major upheaval in modern politics. Lifestyle choices are not taken into account like they should be. That would take a major change in views of right and wrong, also known as morality.
Like or Dislike: 8 3
I definitely agree that we need stronger/longer residency rules.
As far as #3, I think the rule already is that people get no cash assistance for any children born after they first enter the welfare system. I believe the children do qualify for food stamps and medical assistance though.
Like or Dislike: 7 4
You wouldn’t even have to go back as far as the WPA days.
50 years ago or less, the county required people to work for what they got in welfare.
Men used to remove the brush on roadsides and women had jobs like doing laundry at up the Chris Jensen home.
Like or Dislike: 16 2
A year ago, I met a 27-year-old in Duluth who was a client in our health program. While getting to know him, I was shocked with his life story (I rarely am shocked anymore). He seemed to have hours of free time, similar to someone who was retired. I found out that his mother, who had ten children with 6 different men, had all her kids put on disability/SSI (which WE pay for). She was an expert in this and knew that any behavioral problem must be ADHD – she knew the right avenues to take and each kid gets monthly checks – this man, at 27, never went to school and has never has a job. Yet, he considers himself disabled (I didn’t buy it) and won’t do anything to better his life (otherwise he will lose ‘his money’). He is a lost cause. You can not teach work ethic to a 27 year old. That’s something that develops in early adolescence while extra responsibilities are taken. Nobodys ever made him do anything. Yet, claiming he is disablesd, he has no insurance, has no doctor, and has never participated in any psychotherapy programs. Isn’t the goal of disability programs so that the individual is rehabilitated and within a certain timeframe is a productive member in society? Do people get SSI for life? Why aren’t their checks and balances yearly, by a different doctor, of the Social Security Administration’s choice?
His mother needs to spend 10-15 years in Shakopee or the work farm. Ten kids times $662 a month for life when these disabilities are clearly fabricated is criminal. She not only exploited these kids, but also got them to believe they’re disabled, don’t bother doing anything in life, keep lying about it and get by.
We REALLY need to root these people out if they’re caught and enforce it so they can’t produce any moodier children, and if they do, the baby needs to be taken away before she leaves the hospital. They do that with addict mothers, this should be no different. This 27 year olds siblings don’t stand a chance and I guarantee you, by 2030 these programs are going to be gone. Sadly those who truly need it are denied or don’t have the support system to guide them through the process.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 31 5
Obviously, these people should be put away for a long time. But the majority of people on assistance are good, hard-working people who have had a hard time.
More than 80% is welfare recipients are on welfare temporarily, and less that 20% of welfare recipients have been on it for longer than 5 years. More welfare recipients are white than any other race. Welfare is a temporary emergency measure for struggling families.
Hot debate. What do you think? 18 19
And not to hyjack this forum, but abuse takes place at all levels.
I know a small business owner crying for tax relief who just spent $28,000 on his home and “wrote if off as a business expense”. I know another one who started a non-profit and listed friends who live far away as partners so he can visit them and write it off. I watch management at several companies take trips to Alaska for salmon fishing and then have one meeting and write the whole thing off.
I’m not saying this excuses welfare abuse, but it is hardly the only case where people rid off the tax payers =(
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 22 7
I don’t buy it, Sam.
People on this post are complaining about welfare in general, and race is not the issue at hand.
However, POS losers from Chicago hop the Greyhound for St. Louis County, collect their check, stay a few weeks, raise hell, break laws, and then go back to where they came from until the next payday.
Unfortunately, Sam, the majority of those recipients are not white, and they paint a nasty picture that the rest of us have to stare at.
It it far more important to be vigilant about fraud from the rich, which costs society about a million times more than fraud from the poor.
Hot debate. What do you think? 26 12
Maybe they should get all those rich congress people to actually PAY their taxes owed.
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 23 2
Let’s see some examples to back that up.
Like or Dislike: 4 7
I think they should institute drug testing for those on Welfare. Hey, most working people are subject to drug screening if they want to pick up a paycheck, why not them?
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 27 4
While it’s a great idea – I can tell you why that will never happen (even tho I think it should) – because drug and alcohol addiction are considered to be diseases… and it’s illegal to discriminate against someone or deny someone assistance because of a medical condition, which is what a disease is.
Like or Dislike: 8 12
Then they can tell which drug the recipient may be short of?
Like or Dislike: 2 9
Most people working are NOT subject to drug testing. Labor jobs – maybe.
Random drug and alcohol testing would probably work wonders weeding out the riff raff. It’s sad that welfare has become a culture and life style in this country.
Like or Dislike: 17 6
I think these two should be put in charge of the welfare system. They are obviously well intuned to what it takes to survive and would fit in nicely with other Obama appointees.
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 10 27
Rambo, It is funny that you mention Obama, since this fraud occurred from October 2006 to July 2008, which is entirely during the BUSH presidency (Obama was inagurated Jan 21, 2009). So this is not the result of Obama policies!
Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 25 8
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 7 22
you’re not hiding your intelligence level on this post either.
Like or Dislike: 15 5
So what’s your point?
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 3 17
I’m glad they finally started looking at one’s assets and not just one’s income, but there’s still an inequity here. As an example: Joe and I both are married with two teenagers at home, work for the same employer,and have earned the same wage for the same amount of time. Joe is a habitual drinker and gambler, usually leaving little for his family to live on once he blows his paycheck. I on the other hand spent my money on hard assets like a fishing boat and a new car every 5 years. Company X closes down leaving Joe and myself unemployed for months. Joe runs to the county and immediately receives welfare. I am told I’m SOL until I have sold my “assets” and spent the money. Why am I being penalized for being fiscally responsible while Joe gets a free ride on the welfare train? Why are we as a society rewarding lousy behavior while discouraging prudent spending? I just don’t get it….unless that’s always been part of the Left’s sinister plan to redistribute wealth, AKA, taking from those who earned it and giving it to those who already squandered what they were given. LONG LIVE Chairman B. Hussien Obama!
Like or Dislike: 13 15
Hugh, Read the article. All this welfare fraud occurred under a Republican President and a Republican Governor. Why are you associating Obama with this fraud, when he didn’t become president until long after the fraud was over?
Also, you are doing what statisticians call “cherry picking.” You are talking up outlier cases that are not representative of the whole group. The majority of welfare recipients (80%) are only on welfare temporarily and are hard working people.
Like or Dislike: 9 6
just what America needs, another apologist for welfare fraud. Yawn.
Like or Dislike: 5 10
Chairman Mau-bama is without a doubt a communist. Thank you for that Mr. Obvious.
Like or Dislike: 3 9
I would like to see these people who so obviously abused the welfare system and the tax payers punished to the fullest extent of the law. I would also like to see the rich CEOâ€™s, Bankers, Wall Street Tycoons and Insurance company CEOâ€™s that we just bailed out and subsidized to the tune of almost a trillion dollars be held responsible for the plundering of our economy and the thousands of jobs lost because of their greed. They too should be held fully accountable for their actions. Many of them paid themselves a bonus with our money. That should be a crime as well!
Like or Dislike: 14 2
Are you people serious? Get real. The majority of dollars given out for welfare are NOT spent on necessities of life. Go drive through poor parts of Fargo, and delight in the satellite dishes, souped up cars, expensive cell phones, name brand clothes, and other luxurious wastes of tax dollars. Go work in a grocery store and see all the Lutheran Social Services families push their carts full of junk food and soda. What these people did is dime a dozen. They have done absolutely nothing that should single them out from all the rest of the welfare scammers. The only reason they are getting nailed to the cross is because they had a 400k inheritance, that the government is butt hurt over because they didn’t get their taste of it. And I think that’s totally fine. Inheritance is absolutely no business of the governments to tax. I didn’t say I supported their welfare scam, I said I supported them not reporting inheritance. Who cares that they contribute to the majority of wasted welfare dollars. A welfare scam is not news. Failing to report inheritance is though, and that is not right.
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 6 18
Just because they’re living in what you consider to be a “poor part of town” doesn’t mean they’re on welfare. Pointing out their “souped up cars” doesn’t mean much if you don’t have proof of using public assistance without using it wisely.
Like or Dislike: 6 8
That’s not what I said at all, please pay attention. I said the majority of welfare that is received isn’t spent correctly in the first place. You have to go to poor neighborhoods to find welfare recipients. And when you find some, most likely they will have those things I listed. Check mate!
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: 0 10
I am not at all sure how Obama, Clinton, Bush or even God should be brought into this opinion forum of two people who committed fraud. There is one bottom line here…..
We ALL have choices to make every day. Do the Right thing or do what we Know is Wrong. Each of us is responsible or accountable for the choices we make as Adults.
Yes….some have mental deficiencies such as low IQ etc. that make them incapable of knowing the difference between right and wrong, but I seriously doubt that would apply to this situation.
When you take into consideration Teri had recently turned her mother and brother in for pot growing etc., it seems pretty clear Teri knows right from wrong. jmho
Like or Dislike: 13 2
“Yesâ€¦.some have mental deficiencies such as low IQ etc. that make them incapable of knowing the difference between right and wrong, ” My DOG knows the difference between right and wrong. Ignorance, or the portrayal thereof , is no excuse. These folks are habitual/serial violators. Why all the sympathy? If we are free to dismiss the law because of the claim of ignorance, what is left? If we are not a nation of the rule of law, what are we? We are a great, yea, even the greatest, nation in the history of the world. Now the Leftists/progressives/liberals seek to destroy us by undermining the very social fabric that made us great. The rule of law!
Like or Dislike: 5 13
Hey Hugh, If it werent for progessives and liberals, you’d still be getting a buck an hour and not have a bathroom break while at work. Greed is what drove the industrial revolution in the US not the betterment of society. Get that thru your skull now. We are NOT the greatest nation on earth. We pollute the environment at a freakish rate and then say “dont worry about it, the market will take care of it”. We are a greedy nation, look at Wall Street and these people bilking the welfare system so they can have 3 brand new cars. We put more emphasis on sports and money than on education and food production. 3/4 of todays kids dont know what it is to plant a garden or milk a cow or hoe a row. This country doesnt Produce anything anymore. The US does business(management), healthcare, Politics and banking. Beyond that, What do we create? Our manufacturing is gone, our family farms are gone. But at least i’m a progessive that still knows right from wrong.
Like or Dislike: 12 10
Why do people have to “politicize” common sense? Common sense has nothing to do with whether one is liberal or conservative. That’s what’s wrong with us! Quit generalizing and use your noggin’ puddin’ heads!
Like or Dislike: 7 7
If a person has any common sense they’re not liberal.
Like or Dislike: 10 17
Is progressive another word for communist?
Like or Dislike: 11 17
OK Jason, If we are not the greatest nation, who is? And puleeze, don’t bother with the worker’s utopias in Cuba, China or the People’s republic of northern Minnesota. Wages rose because of market forces, not socialist/marxist labor agitators. It’s time you get your history/information from sources other than the mother earth news. And as long as we’re on the topic of food production, if we are not so great, kindly explain why we not-so-great American now spend the lowest percentage of our income of feeding ourselves in our history? 70 years ago we spent 1/3 of our income. Now it is slightly over 10%. Maybe the US should stop producing all that food. Maybe we should just feed ourselves and forget about everyone else. But then the libs would start screaming bloody murder for us withholding all that food. As you can clearly see, there’s just no satisfying the leftist elite. Which brings me to my parting thought: why are so many Democratic candidates multi millionaires while Independents and Republicans are more middle class? How can a liberal, wealthy candidate claim with a straight face, to represent to needs, wishes, and values of the poor? The CAN’T! But the ignorant voters who keep electing these sharks still believe that they can.
Like or Dislike: 7 11
It’s funny you bring up food being cheap for us while basking liberals. Have you ever heard of the Farm Bill? Yes, we have the resources to produce food in abundance, but the government has subsidized food production for years to encourage farmers to continue to produce at high levels. With out those subsidies, commonly know as LDPs, we would have seen production go down when there were significant grain surpluses. Livestock production benefits indirectly from grain subsidies because the supply of grain is steady, but I still remember times when dairy farmers dumped milk to try to get the milk price to go up so they could make a profit. Times have changed now that other markets have been developed to consume grain and less subsidies are going out, but we are spending a higher percentage of our disposable income on food than we did 10 years ago. Short story long, liberal or “socialist” ideals are are partially what has made and kept food affordable in this country.
So you’re saying that price of a product shouldn’t reflect the cost(s) associated with producing it? That subsidies should be embraced? Well here’s a stupid question; “who pays for the subsidies?” We all do! DUH! Is it the consumer’s fault that too many producers got into the market thinking they could make a buck, only to find the market glutted come harvest time? NO! They got greedy and we’re supposed to bail them out? For the record, I am opposed to all this bail out nonsense. The bailees want all the profits without accepting any of the risk. The bail-ers(and yes this ship is sinking)seem to always find themselves getting the short end of the stick. They get all the responsibility for bailing out those acting irresponsibly, but never any of the rewards. In this sense I guess you could say that marxism/communism/socialism is the great equalizer ‘cuz all us little guys are gettin’ screwed. Only the ruling elite in a socialist society fail to share in the pain.
Yes, we do pay for the subsidies through federal income taxes, but I would argue that the “litte guy gettin’ screwed” benefits the most from those subsidies because he or she needs a consistently affordable food supply. The subsidies are there to keep food prices more consistent. Look at what happened when the price of fuel skyrocketed after Katrina. The economy certainly wasn’t stimulated. The same thing would happen if food prices doubled. I’m not “for” bailouts and subsidies for everything. But I am for trying to keep the cost of necessities like food, clothing and energy at a fairly consistent and moderate level. Keeping costs of the necessities low leaves more disposable income available for other goods and services which is good for the economy.
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I found a nice reference site to lookup the history and study trends in farm commondity prices.
Just choose a item, pick the years, select which price to compare, and choose a table or a chart.
I can’t name ONE thing related to putting in a crop, or related farm expense that is the same price NOW that it was back in the mid 70′s? Except for the farmer’s free labor. Yet, the price per bushel of corn was darn close to the same, at the end of last year, as it was 35 years ago. If those prices were to be converted to reflect their purchasing power thru the years, everyone would be able to see what was clear to my father years ago. He decided not to mortgage the farm during a time when interest rates where thru the roof. It also meant that he didn’t lose the farm.
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He must of been one of the few.
There were so many guys I graduated with who went straight into farming, got some acreage from Dad, and immediately took out huge loans for new machinery.
If Jason thinks that the US is a polluting boogieman, what about his model worker’s paradises? China, the Eastern European Countries, the former Soviet Union, Koooba, ALL HAVE HORRIBLE environmental records, records that make us look like saints. The greenies won’t let us make, mine, cut, or pump anything over here anymore, citing environmental concerns, but have no qualms about sending those jobs to China and 3rd world countries that lack ANY environmental oversight. We have the cleanest, most heavily regulated mining and manufacturing on earth. If they’re going to be done anyway, why wouldn’t you support them being done where we can keep an eye on them? You can’t have it both ways.
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Maybe they should of took a lesson from certain people that know how to manipulate the system, even so the system operates in a way that attracts people that use the system to their advantage !
This is nothing new, they just got caught !
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Ahh Hugh. Apparently you havent turned on the TV except to Fox news. Have you not seen the oil gushing into the gulf or whats left of the oil slick from 1989 in ALaska or the Nuke plant in Pensylvania that cant be touched for the next 1000 years or so because it melted down 30 years ago. How bout the hundreds of billions of dollars we’ve spent cleaning up a nuke site in Washington State. Oops forgot about the coal mine tragedy in WV or the dam that broke in KY and all the coal slurry washed out down stream. What country contributes the most to the polluting of the earth??? thats right! WE DO! Besides Chernobyl,The former USSR and communist China dont hold a candle to what we do to the environment.(Well China now uses more energy than us so they should catch us pretty quick in the pollution dept.) I support manufacturing whole heartedly. I just want manufacturing done like Toyota, Honda/Subaru, KIA in clean, energy efficient plants and without dumping their waste all over the ground. Even the Chinese get this idea. They are building wind and hydroelectric plants while we fart around with a new coal gassification plant to generate electricity. See why i cant eat more than 1 fish per month. We love our mercury pollution! I dont want it done like BP/Exxon or US STEEL(west Duluth superfund site) and then expect me to pay to clean it up for them. There is no model workers paradise. You’re either a Lemming for a company or you work for yourself.
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Only one point in that post I disagree with, Jason…
Three Mile Island didn’t melt down. It was averted with the use of a basketball wrapped in tape.
Ahh, American ingenuity! Obama would have called for a study, and then another study of the studies to determine his plan of action. Then he would have commissioned pollsters to inquire which action would have the greatest and least political fallout. By which time, Bobby Jindal would have reached age 40 and demanded that Obama plug the d#*m hole. I find it ironic that in both TMI and Deep Water Discovery disasters, the automatic fail-safes were in place and functional, but were over-ridden by panicky operators at the scene. These weren’t failures of technology or systems, but of people. If they were conservatives, the left would have already tried and convicted the in the media, but I suspect that they were under the influence of THC, and thus not responsible for their actions. Dope addiction is a disease, isn’t it? At least if among libs.
Jason, You are entitled to your own opinion. You are NOT entitled to you own “facts”. You have unwittingly made my argument for me when you said “…How bout the hundreds of billions of dollars weâ€™ve spent cleaning up a nuke site in Washington State…” This proves that you are aware of our domestic regulation and clean up efforts. The former Soviet block and China on the other hand make no such efforts to clean things up. They just bury it, either literally, of figuratively by suppress all access to the information, and via coverup. I suspect that you weren’t old enough to remeber the horrific wastelands the were uncovered by the western media after the iron curtain fell. And even this year, manmade disasters in China outnumbered those of the US by a hugely disproportionate ratio. Add to that the veil of secrecy in the east and it’s remarkable that we were even able to hear about those. Why not humor me and do a simple google search of ” China pollution, and disaster” read a few articles. Then tell me how wonderful chairman Mao’s worker utopia is in dealing with their waste. Oh, and I understand that they’re world leaders in offering human rights to political and religious dissidents. How’s the old saying go, “there is none so blind as he who will not see.”? Maybe it’s time to take off the pinko colored glasses.
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I’ve already done the China pollution search, Hugh, and it turns out that they’ve been working on it for years.
Mostly on air pollution, but they’re working on other things as well. Mainly, province by province.
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One can only conclude that you refuse to see the truth. And as such are nothing more than a waste of our time. If “the truth shall set you free” is true, you must be blogging from within the deepest, most impregnable prison imaginable, the prison of a closed mind.
How long did it take you to read through the 3.5 million references, or did you just ignore them because the didn’t originate with NPR?
bac, and just how clean is their surface water? or worse yet, their ground water?
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Considering they haven’t been industrialized near as long as we have, it’s very likely their water is much cleaner than ours.
We’ve had over a century of dumping everything from raw sewage, bleach from paper mills, you name it, into our water table. How many years has it been since we finally required secondary containment tanks for buried gasoline and diesel storage tanks? Ten, maybe?
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You’re thinking of Chernobyl. Three Mile island not only didn’t melt down but it has been generating electricity ever since the accident. Only the one reactor is shut down. Maybe you should watch Fox News now and then instead of the pablum put out by MSNBC or CNN.
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